>> From WXXI News.

This is Connections.

I'm Evan Dawson.

>> Our connection this hour was made in Maplewood Park in Rochester, where the family playground is back open.

A new nature center is getting ready for launch.

Their construction and rebuilding have filled that space for the better part of two years, and that just happens to coincide with the mass shooting at Maplewood Park that happened on July 28th, 2024.

That shooting shocked the community, and it led to an eight year prison term for the man convicted of reckless endangerment, as well as criminal possession of a weapon.

If you look at a story like that, maybe you think that Rochester is hit with rampant gun violence on a daily basis.

The reality is that Rochester has hit its lowest number of shootings in nearly a decade.

The trends are all pointing in a healthier direction.

Something is working.

City statistics show that the last time gun violence was at this level was in 2018.

My colleague Gino Fanelli reported earlier this year that 2025 saw every major category of crime fall in the city.

That's shootings and stabbings and robberies, everything.

And the Rochester Beacon reports that, according to the RPD, rolling 365 day shooting total, Rochester had 150 shootings over the recent period that ended on May 10th.

That's the recent year ending on May 10th, 150.

That is half of the shootings during the pandemic years.

RPD also reports that 2026 has seen 38 shooting victims and one homicide so far, compared with the same period in 2025.

The department says total shootings have fallen 16%.

Fatal shootings are down 88%, total homicides down 82%.

Again, something is working.

But those who work in violence prevention do not accept that this trend would simply continue without more work.

And my guest today is someone who has worked on gun violence prevention for years.

Justin Morris, the founder of Untrapped Ministries, got a lot going on.

He's got a big bike ride going on.

He's got a documentary documentary that he's working on going on.

It's been a little while.

It's nice to see you.

>> Yeah.

Likewise.

Evan, always a pleasure.

>> And hold on one second.

Now they're telling me we're going to spin your mic around, pull that mic toward me and pull that top part of it down just a little bit.

We'll get it perfect here.

Now, now there you go.

See your narration for the doc coming up here.

We want your voice.

>> Perfect.

I gotta practice right here.

>> So, um, before we get to the bike ride, the doc and all the stuff going on.

I just want to start by asking you if you are surprised at all that the numbers in Rochester are down, because nationally, as you've pointed out, they're down as well, but they're still pretty historically high.

Rochester's really sharply down in the last 12, you know, 18 months.

Are you surprised at all?

>> Uh, I would I would say I'm surprised.

Um, you know, whenever you see a decrease this drastic, um, and you're in the space, you know, you know, the tools that exist and what to expect and when you exceed those expectations, I'll say that's where the surprise comes from.

I really do think that Rochester is a national model on what to do as it relates to violence and violence occurring in a community of this size.

>> Hold on.

>> A second.

>> Say that again here.

Do you think Rochester, in some ways is a national model?

>> Absolutely.

>> You haven't always been the most praising of local efforts.

>> Yeah, and I think that's, uh, you know, a testament to the work that we've put in in this community.

When I say we, that's all parties included.

Uh, when you talk about law enforcement, when you talk about grassroots organizations, when you talk about, uh, the city of Rochester, the county of Monroe, um, you know, one thing about me, I'm a, I'm a straightforward person.

And when somebody has the heart to, to or, you know, the wherewithal to put forth, you know, something like the Emergency Gun Violence Prevention Act, uh, that the city of Rochester has had ongoing for, you know, the last three years.

And I've been very critical of that.

But, uh, to the cities, you know, uh, uh, what is credit, credit, uh, it's working.

Uh, and I'm not going to say it's working in totality.

Totality exclusively by itself.

There's a lot of other things working with it.

But for Malik to be bold, to keep renewing that month after month, uh, I think it's a testament to how he wants to see violence go down in this community.

>> Remind our audience why initially you didn't think that was a good idea.

>> Because we are critical.

A lot of things on the federal level and how Trump makes a lot of his decisions.

And we're just stuck to half the, uh, you know, live with the reality of the decisions he makes.

Um, and I don't think that the community had a large input into the Emergency Gun Violence Prevention Act that we've enacted in Rochester.

And it's literally in the language that every 30 days, the community should convene to talk about possible ways of us being able to govern, you know, in that space, along with government.

Uh, and I don't think that that's happened, but I think that, you know, it is a wise decision by our mayor and our leadership to continue to move in a way that they've been moving.

Now, there is some things that I would do different.

Um, however, I think that has been very effective, very, very effective.

>> I mean.

>> I really admire you sitting here saying that because I know you, you felt strongly about it.

>> So yeah.

And you got to be real with this stuff.

Um, you know, we're talking about on the other side lives being lost, people being wounded.

And when you have a personal feeling or a grievance towards something, um, and the alternative to that, you know, may take a long time to really get to a place where we can sustain a safer city.

Uh, you know, you got to go with what's working.

And if you're going to stay on the side of your opinion just to stay on the side of your opinion, then you don't really have a heart for this work.

>> If listeners want to join the program, you can join the conversation with Justin Morris and myself at 844295 Talk.

It's toll free, 8442958255263.

WXXI if you call from Rochester 2639994.

As always, the email address is connections@wxxi.org at wxxi.org, or you can join the chat if you're watching on the YouTube channel for WXXI News.

And so we'll take some of your feedback as we go throughout the hour here.

You know, I went back and was listening to some of what you and I talked about, especially in, I call it the pandemic year, but 2021, the year after the peak of the Covid pandemic.

But kids were still out of school, people were adrift, shootings were at record highs and violence was at record highs.

And one of the things that you mentioned in that conversation was that you've been in scenarios where someone pulls out a firearm, and then all of a sudden three other people, you know, pull and the people might be surprised at how many people are actively carrying.

>> Mhm.

>> And I wonder if is that still the case?

Or are there still a lot of young men carrying.

>> Absolutely.

Uh, there's, there's still a survival mindset in this city.

Um, there's a saying that our young people say in community now, it used to be stay safe.

It's actually stay dangerous now.

Um, and meaning we're at a point where we've seen those peak years, right?

And when you see a pink ear, you have to understand that there's young people observing that a part of that and it creates a sense of, um, what is it PTSD?

>> Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

>> Um, and in your mind, you kick into survival instincts.

So if you in some circles, if you don't have a firearm, you're laughed at like, oh, you want to die.

Um, so I think what has happened now is our young people have put themselves in a position to always be on offense.

It's never defense because defense means, you know, I could lose my life and you know, be caught up in a situation that, you know, isn't going to be favorable to me.

>> But how are shootings so markedly down then if there's still so much caring and there's this survival mindset that you.

>> Talk about.

>> I think that's where the work comes in at.

I think a lot of the major players have been, uh, aggressively recruited for positive, uh, alignment, you know, uh, you see young people get into the union that have had violent histories.

Young people get into other trades, uh, seek employment, be a part of reentry programing.

Uh, we've been intentional about, you know, one of my mottos that I've always talked about on this show is we need to go after the who's, who's, uh, if they've gone through a court system, they're out here in the community.

Uh, to our understanding, they're not going anyway.

So we need to be actively recruiting these young people to get them into programing and change the mindset.

Um, and, you know, being on the inside and having, you know, the information, we've seen a lot of those young people who are real players actually changed their lives.

And when you're in a city that small, ten people can change the whole dynamics of this city.

Ten individuals who have high affiliation, high ranking can change the whole entire dynamics of this city.

So if you have seven of them working, seven of them gainfully employed with a realistic outlook towards the future, um, you can actually absolutely see, you know, a drastic change in what it is we look at as community as it relates to violence.

>> Wow.

>> Um.

>> Are you let's talk about more how you, how you do that because one of the other kind of ongoing threads is who has credibility, who has credibility on the street.

I often think about that Steve Buscemi meme where he's, you know, he's this 40 year old in a high school trying to play a teenager.

And he's going, hello, young people, you know, carrying the boombox.

And they're all looking at him like, who is this loser?

People can smell it immediately.

If you don't have credibility.

>> Yeah, it's an instant authenticity.

Um, you come from the approach of being relevant but not overcompensating.

Your relevancy.

Um, young people can sniff it out from a mile away.

And when you engage these young people, you just have to be genuine, you know what I mean?

Uh, you may not know.

Look at what I just said.

I just used their lingo and like, stay dangerous.

I'm not going to walk away from a kid and say, stay dangerous.

I'm going to stay, stay, stay, stay safe.

You know what I mean?

I'm going to continue to operate within the realm that I come from.

Uh, now, if I stay, stay dangerous, they're gonna be like, who is this old guy telling me to stay dangerous?

You know what I mean?

Uh, it's being your authentic self and having something tangible that the young people can grab hold to and say, okay, this is real.

Being able to follow up, being able to say, you know, meet me over here.

You know, I'm going to get you connected to this opportunity.

Young people aren't going to trust what's not consistent.

Um, so when we look at these variables, you know, you have to be able to relate in a way where, okay, I got your attention.

Okay, now let me execute on what it is that I said I can do for you.

And I think that gets you in any circle.

And then, you know, it's not so much talking about what you've done.

Other people in the community are going to kind of, oh, you know, Justin helped me with this.

Oh, you know, Justin was in the same life you was in and he changed his life.

And look what he's doing, you know, and then, you know, you got to appeal in different ways.

You know, wear some nice clothes, some nice sneakers.

Sometimes it's a conversational piece, you know what I mean?

>> And so is it.

Then the case with all of the firearms that are still out there.

You talk about PTSD from these peak violence years that a lot of kids, young men, mostly men, experience and see and still feel the effects of.

So they're carrying, they're thinking, you know, maybe kill or be killed, maybe the order of the day.

Is it eventually true that you think you can convince people to give up their weapons or right now, is it, you know, what are the strategies of dealing with the fact that there are so many that are out there?

>> So, so I've never worked from the reality of getting young people to give up their weapons.

Um, I've always worked from the reality of getting young people to do different things with their times that may, you know, result in them making that decision or result in the method that we see now where everything's holstered right now.

There's nobody, I'm not going to say nobody like it doesn't exist.

But, you know, random crime just isn't, uh, the norm anymore.

You know, a lot of young people have chosen to host their weapons or get rid of them if they're getting rid of them.

You know, unbeknownst to me, I don't know what they're doing with them, but we don't see guns coming out and being the answer to resolving conflict as much as we've seen in previous years.

>> All right.

>> So let me grab, uh, let me grab a call from Sam in Rochester who wants to jump in on this?

Hey, Sam.

Go ahead.

>> Hi.

So I am a social worker in the city, and I and I work in a middle school, so I'm working with kids who are like, you know, 11, 12, 13 years old.

And with the guests that a few minutes ago about the survival instinct, the survival mode, I think, is something that kids in our city are living with from like a really young age.

Like this isn't just something that happens, right?

When they get to the adolescence.

I feel like I see these kids living in this mindset from like the time that they're tiny.

And I guess one of the things that I'm interested in hearing the guests talk about is like, what opportunities do we have as a community to intervene before these kids are picking up guns?

Because as a person who works in a middle school in the city, I am already hearing about students who are posting photos with weapons or showing them to other people.

You know, when they're outside of school.

So like, this is starting young and I just am wondering, what can we do to prevent it in the first place?

Because it's going to keep being a problem, right?

Unless we kind of get to the front end.

>> Sam.

Great questions.

I'll let Justin jump on that.

First of all, how young are some people having guns for the first time?

>> So ten years old, uh, you know, Monroe County Children's Detention Center houses young people at the age of ten.

Uh, you know, I worked there for a long time and we seen youth as young as ten coming in on gun charges and possession of guns.

Um, I think the reality is there's a system that exists that's broken.

Um, and until we align and reengage the reality of what that system is, when you talk about the school to prison pipeline, when you talk about the educational structure, when you talk about a union in this city, um, when you talk about all of these variables that have existed for the last 30 years.

Um, and have failed to target, uh, and just use buzzwords like school to prison pipeline, as opposed to really getting in and creating some strategic planning around how to engage that population.

Uh, I think, you know, careers should be pushed at that age, right?

We should have public safety access, we should have culinary access.

We should not wait until a child is in high school to introduce those opportunities, but introduce them to them at an early age.

When I was in kindergarten, I knew I wanted to be a cop.

Right?

But from kindergarten to 12th grade, nobody talked to me about public safety and different opportunities to engage in that space.

There was one school offering that type of program in East High School, firefighter public safety and different things like that.

I didn't go to East, so that wasn't afforded to me.

I went to John Marshall and Charlotte High School.

So, you know, I did what was accessible in those schools.

But if we create a broad system of access to young people at that age, because guess what?

Even at that age, you don't have a choice.

If mom says you're going to public safety camp for the summer, you're going to public safety camp.

You can learn how to be a firefighter or a police or EMT in third grade.

Now your interest is sparked for two weeks out of the year.

Um, and there's something that's being planted in your spirit.

So we're not investing in young people until they get to an age where defiance is already rooted in them.

You know what I mean?

At the age of 15, 16, I don't care where you're at.

You could be in middle suburbia, you could be in urban, um, America.

Defiance is going to be in you.

So we're trying to get a demographic of young people who are naturally defiant to start engaging in processes where they kind of already have their mind made up.

And we haven't planted the seed previously.

So if we begin to start planting those seeds at second, third, first grade, uh, and really invest from that time on, we can see a total change in how young people want to engage later in their scholastic, uh, you know, reality.

>> And.

>> And I'm thinking of Sam's point about, you know, people, young people are going to be at forks in the road and a lot of points in their life.

But a big one is who you're surrounding yourself with and choices you make that, you know, might have really permanent or serious consequences.

Um, and if we're sitting here right now, as we are with gun violence down in a way that is no one is saying it's at a level that is perfect or is the the final end point of success, but it's much better than it was four years ago.

It's the best it's been in a decade, and everyone wants to see it continue to get better.

But you're also sitting here saying, look, look, there's still a ton of guns out there.

>> There's still.

>> AM I wrong to think that my fear is if some of the conditions that lead to desperation or nihilism or hopelessness don't change, that we could easily see this trend reverse and go back up.

>> And the recipe for disaster is there.

When you look at peak years of any violence, look at the price of eggs.

Look at the price of gas.

>> Serious price.

>> Of groceries.

Yeah, we are headed back in that direction.

Where desperately if I said that right.

>> Desperation.

>> Desperation is a reality.

And the young people are still in the same position.

They were two, three, four years ago when we seen the spikes, meaning that there are still weapons out here.

And when you look at where Rochester sits in the borders that we sit, and we have proximity to, um, there's always going to be that reality that Rochester is a easy space to get guns into because of the borders that are surrounding us and the gun laws that exist.

Uh, just on the other side of those borders or those state lines.

>> Short drives that you've talked about.

>> What Pennsylvania.

>> Pennsylvania, uh, even some of the most southern part of the country is ten hours away.

Ten hour drive is nothing for these young people.

And we've seen it.

We've seen young people in other spaces.

There is case law.

There is case that cases that we've seen with young people being caught with weapons that were coming into Rochester, and we have to start being more transparent about this.

You know, there's an iron pipeline that that's talked about all throughout the state.

And a lot of civilians aren't educated on this.

Guns are coming into our community at a very high rate.

Uh, and like I said, they're holstered now, but we have a recipe, uh, and we're embarking in territory where, you know, young people may start Xi, uh, you know, engaging in those acts.

>> Uh.

>> Thank you, Sam, for the phone call.

It's 844295 talk toll free 8442958255263.

WXXI if you call from Rochester 2639994, the email address connections@wxxi.org.

You can join the chat on YouTube.

My guest is Justin Morris, the founder of Untrapped Ministries, and someone who in our second half hour, we're going to talk a lot more about he's got a bike ride coming up, a documentary he's working on, and he's worked for years in the space of of gun violence.

Let me get Gary's email.

And Gary says an article in yesterday's Democrat and Chronicle cited that 1 in 4 black youth live outside of a nuclear family.

The family units they live in tend to be female led.

What opinion does your guest have about a lack of male role models on this topic?

>> Uh, structure, uh, is structural.

Um uh, alignment.

I think, um, when we talk about housing projects, when we talk about Cabrini-Green out of Chicago, which was one of the nation's first housing project, other examples, Queensbridge out of New York City, one of the requirements to actually live in those projects was that you couldn't have a male presence in the home, uh, to receive social services, to receive the benefits.

It was frowned upon for there to be a able bodied working male in that home.

And so for mothers to provide for their children.

And back then, we had a lot more children, a part of the family structure, six, seven, eight children, right, on average for a black and brown led household.

Right.

And in order to bear that expense and get government assistance, there's a movie called Claudette.

I encourage the whole entire listening, uh, listeners, to go watch this movie called Claudette.

But what it was, was you couldn't have an able bodied working man in that house and still receive those benefits.

So what happened was, okay, you got to get out of here because we can't afford, based upon what you bring in and what I bring in to support this family, right?

At the same time as that's being enacted in real time, colleges and universities are studying through rats, through dogs, through different animals on what does it look like when you take the male structure out of the family setting?

And what they seen was the male rats begin to act out more aggressively.

The male dogs begin to act out more aggressively.

The female dogs and rats begin to act more promiscuously.

Um, and that carried over into what we see in society right now that the father is gone.

The mother is trying to raise this young man.

The young man is going out and seeking a family structure.

And that sternness that he got from his father previously, and he's finding it in a gang.

And now the narrative of the gang in the 70s and 80s shifted over from standing for community to more of a, you know, violence based approach to get things that you wanted.

So I'm paraphrasing, but to answer his question, this is where you've seen the societal breakdown because in the 60s, 70s, 50s.

We were family oriented.

We did have the family structure.

And because of governmental assistance, I'm not going to say solely because of it, because of the access.

>> In part.

>> Because of actual policy.

>> Yes.

>> Uh, the New Deal, right.

Um, we've seen every ethnic group at that time get you had the polish get, and I may be saying this wrong, but you had, uh, the Polish get the fire department, the Irish get the police department.

The Italian-Americans get access to the unions.

We didn't get access to any of that.

We had to figure it out.

And we got a social service.

Right?

A social service that told us exactly what I just illustrated.

Now, that's not the reality for all of black and brown families, but that was the reality for most of us and has had a lasting effect till this day.

>> And to be clear, you feel like whatever the reason that a young man, a black boy in Rochester, would grow up either fatherless or without a consistent figure.

Whatever the reason, there are serious consequences.

>> Serious consequences.

And that's genetically proven.

That's scientifically proven.

That's proven, spiritually proven.

It's proven across all fronts.

And it's a notion that can't be debunked.

You have success stories of single mothers raising admirable young men, but you have the stories of the exact opposite.

And those are the ones that we remember.

>> I mean, somebody said to me recently, I'm from Cleveland.

Someone said, that's the curse of the LeBron James story.

It's like, well, look, you know, Gloria James and LeBron James.

Well, not everybody.

>> Is one out of.

>> A million.

Maybe a billion, right?

>> I mean.

>> Yeah, so.

>> Uh, the reality of the cause and effect of different systematic systems that have been structured for whatever reason, um, you know, it's had a lasting effect when you look at now, here's a critical point.

When you look at what's going on in Rochester right now as it relates to affordable housing, you see all of these one units going up and all these apartments and different things like that.

It's not a direction to build a structure for family.

It's a direction to build the structure for what?

A single mother with one or 2 or 3 children.

These aren't family units that's going up and they're going up in such a high of volume that, again.

>> Are.

>> They're not nuclear family units.

>> Nuclear family units.

Uh, when, when, when you see that and you see what took place 60, 50 years ago, you see what we're doing is recycling the same realities.

Now it's a smaller family size, but the reality of being able to access certain things in community, um, outside of the presence of a male figure, uh, is still a very strong reality because these units are contingent upon a mother being a single mother.

Um, not having a structural nuclear family.

Like, as you just mentioned.

Um, and we're building these at record pace everywhere you look and we think on the outside looking in, oh, this is great.

Rochester is attacking the housing issue and we're not.

And that correlates into where you see some of the most violence in the country.

You're going to see housing issues.

You're going to see, you know, lesser access to, uh, you know, fresh qualities of foods and different things of that nature.

And look, in these communities.

>> All right.

Last thing before we take a break, and then we're going to talk about some of the things that Justin's working on right now.

When we were here a couple of years ago, talking about car thefts, we were talking about Kias and Hyundais in particular, because of the way that those were designed.

And they can be hot wired and stolen.

And, you know, people driving them at high speeds and doing what they did.

And I mean, I'm sure that happens to some degree.

It's, uh, the numbers are down, but they're not zero, but they were extremely high a couple of years ago, Rochester got involved with this lawsuit about it.

And when you were on this program, correct me if I'm wrong here, I, I thought you were pretty blunt about the fact that you thought at times we were being too light on kids who were stealing cars, but sometimes they needed a firm, a firmer legal response is that is that fair?

>> Yeah, absolutely.

>> Okay.

>> So how do you see that now?

>> Uh, still still think that it's the same reality?

Um, I think we've had a lot of people advocate for things in our community that it's not their everyday reality.

Um, when you go ask Miss Jones on Wilkins Street or miss, um, you know, Johnson on Avenue D, uh, what they would like to see, their reality is far different than a lot of our liberal counterparts.

>> I was.

>> Going to say, I think you're talking about white suburban liberals, right?

>> Yeah.

>> White suburban liberals who probably in your mind have good intentions but haven't lived in some of these zip codes where this is happening.

>> Absolutely.

And we have to live with the reality.

And I don't think a lot of times that the people who have vested interests in these communities, voices are ever heard.

When you show up to city council meetings, when you show up to county meetings, the people that are speaking on these issues don't look like us, but they've rallied around and galvanized the support, uh, to have a large enough following to where politicians, lawmakers are listening, and then they're going back and they're creating systems that really imprison the people that live in these communities.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a young black and brown boy being held responsible for their actions, whether that be car theft, whether that be robbery, whether that be, you know, a myriad of different things that exist.

Because at the end of the day, we're saying we have the competent people to provide the opportunities to deter them from this.

So if they've heard and they've had access to individuals and we've done the saturation outreach, when they commit that crime, it's time to face the reality of what it is you did.

And that's where we see a lot of these repeat offenders.

When you look at the epidemic that we've seen with pandemic epidemic that we've seen with car theft, um, most of those offenders, seven out of ten were repeat offenders and not just second time repeat offenders, some of them 4 or 5 times, have been arrested for stealing cars.

And then when you look at vehicular manslaughter and different things like that, a lot of these young people had killed people at the hands of these vehicles and have been killed in these vehicles.

And when you look at how crime was being committed during that period in time, uh, it was a known fact that you go get a Kia and you commit a crime.

You know what I mean?

So there were.

>> Several commit a crime without without too much consequence.

>> Well, the getting the Kia to commit the crime is to be able to evade any detection.

I'm in somebody else's car.

This is a stolen car.

RPD corroborate this.

Uh, a lot of the crime that we've seen was done out of stolen cars.

When drive bys and different things like that.

And now if I don't know who was in this car and I can't trace it back to anybody, we have a crime that's basically unsolvable.

>> I think part of what I'm wondering is, apart from actual policy on how we deal with crimes at different ages, I'm wondering about the culture.

Do you think it is true that teenagers, often young men, feel like, I'm not going to get that much of a penalty for this.

Like, I can get away with this.

It's not that big a deal.

>> Absolutely.

And when you work in an environment, it's almost comical how you have caseworkers that come in and think they're making all of the difference.

And you, as a worker who works day to day with these young people, are just sitting back.

I'll tell you this scenario.

The kids sitting on the bed, the counselor is standing up above the kid talking to him, and the worker is usually in the back at the door, making sure nothing goes on and the counselor is just engaged.

Like engaged.

Oh, I'm just so concerned.

And the kid is looking up at this staff smirking, and the staff is just shaking his head because the kid knows he's getting over on his counselor.

You know what I mean?

He knows that the counselor has a bleeding heart, knows that they want to see, and the kid is.

>> Well intended.

>> It's well intended on the counselors.

Yeah, but it's also you have to get into a space and a mindset to understand the totality of the circumstances.

Yeah.

If I'm a young person and I know I can get over on you, my job is to get over on you.

Now, if you're not doing the work to figure out what that looks like, you're going to get played a lot.

And that's what we see a lot of times with people coming in, making policies For, you know, us.

And then in that environment, oh, you know, their frontal lobe isn't developed and they, they don't have the reasoning to be able to make a rational decision.

We understand that.

But also let's not underestimate how smart they really are and how they know this system.

These kids have been coming in some of these systems since they were ten years old.

>> Is this when you talk about the well-intended white liberals who don't live in these zip codes, is this related to the discourse in the last decade about defund the police?

>> Absolutely, absolutely, 1,000%.

And it also leads us to a lot of failed opportunity.

Um, I feel like violence prevention should be an element that is funded out of public safety and in proximity and adjacent to policing.

Uh, but a lot of times in those spaces, police are looking at it like, oh, one speaks for all.

And that's not true.

It's not true.

I'm a person that comes out of the streets, has a ton of street credibility, is revered for never having snitched.

And, you know, all of the cool things that come with coming out of the streets.

And one of the biggest failed opportunities we've had in this community is that the police won't take us serious and violence prevention because they think all of us have the same outlook, and we don't want to be, you know, in proximity to, listen, I'm certified, I'm stamped in my community.

I don't fear or, you know, have any reservations about working with police and working adjacent to police to, you know, uh, get a better resolve in our community.

I'm confident in who I am, but what happens is, you know, we have individuals who speak on behalf of all individuals in our community, and it makes it impossible for us to build any type of meaningful, structured relationship with our PD or any other police entity in this community, law enforcement entity, in this community.

Thankfully, you know, I'm a true grassroots organization and I kind of go at the beat of my own drum.

So I have those relationships, uh, and I'm still able to walk about my community.

Nobody looks at me as, oh, he's going to tell on us and different things like that, because that's not what that relationship is for.

That relationship is for to acknowledge that, listen, these people are out here doing a job.

They have a job to do.

We actually need them.

Um, and if this relationship is good and we can build synergy in these spaces, we'll have a lot better community.

Shout out to Justin over in recruiting for RPD.

I think, you know, for the first time in a long time, we're targeting a demographic of young people in our community that can actually go in and do the job and have the cultural competency, um, the implicit bias that we lack a lot of times in those positions.

Um, and those are the failed opportunities to get young people engaged and to let young people see, listen, this guy comes from the streets.

He's not as scared to stand over there with the police officer and have a conversation.

Or when I see, uh, Smith downtown, slap him up, give him a hug, or when I see Charles Salina, US marshal, uh, you know, have a conversation with him and different things like that.

You know, these are things that, you know, because certain individuals are advocating for us, that we're missing out opportunities on.

And then we'll complain, okay.

If the conversation isn't defund, then why aren't we driving our young people to go into the workforce and change the dynamics?

>> So when we come back here, we're going to talk about what Justin is doing next.

Here.

We've kind of set the scene for a pretty remarkable moment in Rochester.

If you're just joining us, gun violence is at an eight year low.

Um, it's going down nationally.

But if you look at the Pew data, it is down.

It's still, you know, vis a vis history, pretty high.

It's down in the last five years.

And it's down in Rochester even more than that, really, really significantly.

So we've talked about what's worked, what doesn't work, and why that might be kind of a tenuous situation that could eventually move in a different direction.

If we're not careful, we're going to talk to Justin Morris about what he's doing next.

On the other side of this break.

Coming up in our second hour, we sit down with pairs of people, some young students.

I think they're very young, and some older adults who are getting together to talk about the differences in generations, sharing their own wisdoms and questions and ideas about the world, and a couple of local programs.

And we're going to find out what they are learning from each other.

That's coming up next hour on Connections.

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From developing life skills to gaining independence.

Mary Cariola, center.

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>> This is Connections.

I'm Evan Dawson Justin Morris is riding on Juneteenth to Albany.

>> Albany, New York.

>> You're getting on a bicycle and we're not talking about an e-bike.

>> No.

>> And you're going from Rochester.

>> To Albany.

>> To Albany.

>> Uh, in between, I'll be stopping in Newark.

I'll be stopping in Syracuse.

I'll be stopping in Schenectady.

And ultimately, uh, on our way to Albany.

Um, this is a journey that I think is necessary.

Uh, being that we are in a place in, you know, our reality is that violence is down.

You know, what do doctors do when they come and created a opportunity to say, you know, we got good ground on this disease or, you know, we're in a better space as it relates to cancer research and different things like that.

They do five k walks and different things to keep that awareness going, but also celebrate the fact that we're in a good place and we're gaining traction.

Uh, as it relates to actually, uh, you know, getting things under the wraps.

So I want to keep this issue at the forefront of people's minds.

And how do you do that?

You got to sacrifice something.

And in my instance, I want to sacrifice, you know, my physical body to keep people on high alert that this is a reality that we're faced with.

Um, like we've discussed here in this, our crime is down, but the reality of guns being in our community is still a prevalent reality.

Let's go across the state, have conversations with some different organizations, that being Syracuse, that being, uh, Utica, Utica is a space in between Syracuse and Schenectady.

So I'll be stopping in Utica to let's have some conversations with the organizations in those community, see what they're doing as best practices and be able to adopt some of that and bring it back to here in Rochester, or just create a statewide, uh, outlook on just the reality of where we are as it relates to gun violence prevention in its totality.

>> Okay.

So are you going on, are you leaving on Juneteenth?

>> I am leaving on Juneteenth.

>> How many days do you plan to ride?

>> Uh, I'm giving myself a full week, so it'll be Friday to Friday.

Um, according to logistics, it should take me four days.

But as you can see, your viewers may can't see.

I am a 280 pound guy, so you know, it's going to take me, uh, a nice coast.

I'm not going to be Lance Armstrong.

I didn't say anything about that.

>> Are you are you an experienced rider?

>> I am not I am a very novice rider.

Um, in fact, I actually couldn't start training until this week here.

I've done a lot of aerobic training to get ready.

So if you notice, I've lost over 100 pounds.

Um.

>> I mean, again, I don't talk about the weights of the guests, but you look great.

>> Thank you, I appreciate it.

You feel good.

Yeah, I do, I do, uh, so this is going to be, uh, you know, a task, but I feel like, you know, I've done the aerobic work and now my trainer just cleared me to get on a bike this week and actually start training for the actual ride.

Uh, he didn't want me to do too much damage before the ride.

All the damage is going to happen on the ride because, you know, muscles got to break down and different things like that on a almost 300 mile bike ride.

>> Yeah, that's a serious stuff.

Now you, you're, you're having these meetings as you go and you're going to try to learn about what's happening in different communities.

Um, you're going to get all the way to Albany.

Um, are you, do you feel like, let me put it this way, whether it's New York, whether it's New York State or whether it's Rochester, whatever level of government, what is not happening that you still want to see happen?

If you're going to Albany and you're going to sit down with leaders, or if you're talking to people here, what is still not getting done?

>> Uh, grassroots organizations are not getting the access.

Um, that would really help make a difference to resources and the gun violence prevention space.

And there's a lot of organizations that's being allowed to jump around from issue to issue right now that violence is down, gun violence in particular is down.

There is a push for every organization to start.

Uh, applying for domestic violence money.

So previous organizations that you've seen who became experts overnight on gun violence prevention are now becoming experts on domestic violence.

So I think that larger organizations are allowed to jump around into these pots of money, into these pots of resources, and get access because of, you know, the appeal that it may have politically.

Uh, how many people work for that organization?

Um, and different things of that nature.

So I think one of the issues that we have in New York State is there's far too much grant hopping.

Uh, and people that are in this pocket need to be given access to resources and the credibility because, um, I mean, you could see from me sitting at this table for the last four years, we've evolved this work.

We have drastically evolved this work, we've added new outlook, we've added intellect, we've added intellectual property to this work.

Um, and we need to be reassured that every year resources are going to be there.

You know, it doesn't have to be a drastic amount each year, but resources are going to be there for us to continue this work as they are in other spaces.

That's why the bike ride is important.

That's why I continued advocacy in overall evolution in the space is important because when you have these peak and valley years, um, we need to justify why we still are relevant in the valley years.

>> So are you asking the public to fund your bike ride?

>> No, not not this year.

Uh, I want the public to trust that I can do it.

So, uh, it is funded by the Wilson Foundation.

They did ask me, um, for myself to solicit resources, but I just feel like I'm, I'm a real, you know, I'm a straight shooter.

Uh, I don't want anybody giving me something for a task that I may not, can't complete.

Uh, I want to get it done.

I want to show the people on next year.

Uh, when I do solicit resources that this is a major part of our organization.

And this is something that we're going to be doing because it's Albany this year, maybe Albany next year, but eventually we're going to be riding to DC to bring awareness to these issues that's happening in our community.

>> And you're also working on a documentary?

>> Yes.

Uh.

>> What's going on?

>> Four part docu series.

We have Tisha Manning from Maplewood.

We have Stephen Killens, uh, a childhood friend of mine.

We have Demario Moore, and we have a Raekwon Jones.

These are all victims of unintended gun violence in the community of Rochester.

Uh, this documentary was also just picked up on every major platform.

So we have a production distribution deal through a friend of mine out of Dallas.

Her name is Kiana Hannah.

She has signed a distribution deal with the Remy Ma network, uh, who has licensing to all of the major platforms.

So this isn't just a documentary that's going to be released in Rochester.

This will be a global, uh, project that we're working on.

So it's a four part series, uh, highlighting these families and the consequence and the reality of, you know, being in the wrong place at the wrong time, not the consequence on the person that was there, but the consequence on the individual who may have committed the act.

Um, we're going to talk about that, highlight that I have a trailer for that, um, that I could send over to you.

>> Can we put, can we put it in our show notes?

Are you ready to do that?

>> I have not released the trailer.

So I, there is some editing that I want to do to it.

>> You want to break any news, you can do it.

>> Yeah, yeah.

So, uh, the producer would be very upset if I released.

>> It so soon.

>> Yeah, soon.

>> Soon, soon.

What do you actually expect the full timeline to be?

When do you think this is done and consumed?

>> So I'll be completely blunt and honest.

The only hold up right now is me.

Uh.

I have not narrated the documentary yet.

Everybody has shot their part.

We shot back in February.

Um, and we had some oh man, we got some really, really good stuff on there.

But I have not narrated this documentary yet, and I have to sit down this week, start my narration, uh, for the documentary.

>> Where are you doing that?

Like WXXI studios or somewhere else?

>> I would love to do it at w xAI Studios so we could talk offline.

That would be great.

>> I can't make you any offers.

I just know that we're going to be doing more work with creators in the community.

>> Okay, well, we'll lock that in because what I haven't told you is we're doing Dallas, Texas two.

So we're finishing up Rochester.

We're doing Dallas, Texas.

We're doing Louisville, Kentucky, and we're also doing, uh, I said, Louisville, Montgomery, Alabama.

Okay.

All similar communities being that they're not the major city in the market, but they're cities that's plagued by violence in that market.

So Dallas, Fort Worth, that's what we're doing in Dallas.

Okay.

Similar city to Rochester.

>> All right.

So once that's done, we'll come back on when you're ready to kind of put that out to the public.

And I'm sure we'll talk about that.

But you mentioned Tasha Manning from Maplewood.

Yes.

So, um, first of all, can you just briefly describe Tasha's story?

>> Tasha is a story, man, uh, that's near and dear to my heart because the reality of where she was at that age, I was in the exact same place.

Uh, she was working for the city school district, and she was working at the rec center at that age.

I was working for the city school district, and I was working at that rec center.

At that age, I was going to parties with my older siblings, enjoying myself and not ever having it dawn on me the present danger that exists of being in some of those environments.

And although she's a young lady and you know, I'm a male, when I look back at her story and I say, you know what?

If that day would have been my reality, look what the world would have missed.

And when I think about that young lady, look what the world is missing.

Um, and, you know, I have a really good relationship with her mother, um, her sisters, and, you know, just talking to them and seeing how strong they are, but also their moments of vulnerability.

And this is a, this is another thing that I've been very critical, you know, it's not a, just an appearance.

If I'm not going to be critical, we in Rochester have to be mindful that we've had two of the largest mass shootings in the state go unsolved.

When you talk about Pennsylvania Avenue and when you talk about Maplewood, I think I broke the math down on that.

That's 24 victims for homicides, three of those being women, one being young, one young men.

Those are all of the advocating pieces for us to be in an outrage as a community.

You mentioned earlier in the introduction that they had one person in custody that's serving an eight year sentence, but that's not the shooter.

Uh, and I felt like that was handled very poorly.

His defense was given to him during a press conference.

When they came on and did the press conference about announcing him, they were very clear to the public that he's not the person of interest for the actual shooting.

So if I'm a lawyer, I'm calling my client like, listen, you don't got to worry about that element of it.

Uh, you know, this is what needs to happen.

So now we eliminate the access of even understanding who we were shooting at, you know what I mean?

Because RPD gave you defense basically being overzealous and, you know, wanting the people to come forward who actually did it, I think we did ourselves a disservice because we kind of exposed what we didn't know.

Um, but again, I want to sound the alarm on that Rochester, New York right now, as it relates, has two of the state's largest mass shootings that's going on so well.

>> And so maybe that's a good point to wrap here.

I want to tie a couple things together there.

You know, I live in Charlotte.

I drive by that Maplewood side all the time.

And there's a lot of things that are happening there.

Now that nature centers coming playground there, families are going to be back there.

And I'm sure some people feel scarred from that still, which, I mean, I get I'm also thinking about the public debate about, you know, these crowds of people kind of taunting and fighting up at, uh, Charlotte Beach.

And, you know, now the police have more of a presence there.

Mayor Evans said that he thought the way those mostly teenagers were acting at Charlotte Beach was that they were hoping that someone would break up the fight, that they, you know, that this was a lot of posturing, but it wasn't going to get worse.

It wasn't going to become a mass shooting.

It wasn't really going to go down that way.

How do you see that one.?

>> That's totally not accurate.

Uh, these young people are impulsive.

Uh, somebody gets the best of somebody in an instant.

>> And again, I don't want to speak for the mayor.

I'm trying to sum up here.

I mean, he was extremely critical of it and saying that they're going to put police down there and they have, uh.

>> So I think the mayor, uh, speaks from a very informed standpoint.

Mayor Evans is from this community.

Uh, and again, a lot of people our age do look at it like that.

You know, uh, I used to always look like, look at it like that.

Oh, these young people ain't really like that.

You know, they're in our culture.

They're fronting, right?

They're putting up a front and they want people to engage, which is all true until you get that member.

I said, it's ten of them who will change the whole dynamics of everything in this community who are like that.

Uh, so what if one of that ten.

>> Takes one.

>> Step and he pulls that gun?

And now guess what?

Remember, everybody else is holstered.

They just waiting.

They're playing offense.

So now you get one shooting.

You get a bunch of them shooting.

Uh, also in that press conference, the mayor said, you know, why aren't they going in alleys?

I don't think it's appropriate for us to be challenging kids to go in alleys.

And I know that's not what he meant when he said that.

>> No, I think I get what he said.

But the point is, you're saying that was a powder keg that really could have blown.

>> That really could have blown up, really could have blown up.

Um, and I think we have to be mindful of that because if that happens out there, um, let's say it doesn't happen out there, right?

Let's say that same group of kids is another place in the city.

Um, and I'll tell you why it's never happened out there.

And, you know, the occurrences that have happened out there are, you know, scattered, uh, people know it's hard to get from out there to that beach.

It's very hard to commit a crime out there and get back into the city.

>> That's a good point.

>> So, you know, maybe next time it's not at the beach, maybe it's at a more local park.

And, you know, the reality of it happening there is far more prevalent than the reality of it happening at the beach.

>> Good luck with your bike ride.

Appreciate it.

You're going to do great.

You look great.

Appreciate it.

Sounds like you're going to be ready for it.

Um, and then come back and talk to us when the doc is ready to roll.

>> Let's do that.

That would be the and I'll bring the whole production team.

Yeah, yeah.

>> I really appreciate you being here and sharing your insight with us.

And thanks for being here.

>> Appreciate you for having me.

Ever.

>> Justin Morris on Connections, more Connections coming up in just a moment.

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