From Sky news.

This is connections.

I'm Evan Dawson.

Our connection this hour was made in the spring of 2019, when a man had a seizure while walking into a parking lot after his workout.

Steve Rolle grew up with epilepsy, but it was well controlled and he had gone around ten years without a seizure.

That day in 2019, as he was being hauled into an ambulance, he writes that it occurred to him he was not going to be allowed to drive a car for at least six months.

Writing for Reconnect Rochester, Rolle says, quote, I was scared of losing my independence to get around because I relied solely on my car for transportation.

That's why this is called car dependency.

End quote.

But Steve learned that he could do a lot of traveling without a car.

It was a significant change, and we'll find out this hour if he would say it's changed his life for the better.

His story is part of a new series on Reconnect Rochester that is all about going car light.

Not fully car free if that's not possible, but Car Lite, could you do it?

One generation that is doing it is Gen Z. Gen Z is driving less.

They are less likely to have a driver's license than previous generations.

In fact, the percentage of young people with driver's licenses has been steadily declining since the 1980s.

Here's a number 1983 80% to 18 year old Americans had a driver's license.

Today, it's down to less than 60%.

Some of the reason is economic.

Some of it is cultural and lifestyle.

And we're going to talk this hour about what it means to go car lite.

Our guest this hour includes Steve Rolle, a board member now for Reconnect Rochester.

Welcome.

Thank you for being with us.

Thank you for having me.

Chaz Goodman is a marketing and outreach manager for Reconnect Rochester.

Welcome, Chaz.

Thanks for being here.

Happy to be here.

Sarah Jenks is a Rochester resident that I was looking at.

I think it's 7 or 8 years since we last talked on this program.

How are you?

I'm good.

I'm happy to be back.

Thanks.

And you're not.

You know, you're still in that category.

Well, how would you categorize yourself?

Car, a light car.

I would say I'm car light now.

I think the first time I was here, I was 98% car free.

All right.

Car light.

Still able to do a car light lifestyle.

Correct.

All right.

We're going to talk about how.

By the way, I love these Gen Z numbers because Gen Z, you know I remember turning 16 and the pressure, it's like, well, you know, you got to get your license.

You got it.

And now Gen Z is like, why I it's amazing how often you talk to people now or 16, 17, 18 like, do you have a license?

Like why would I have a license?

Like, like, well, why do I want to own a car for the so expensive.

I mean, you hear this all the time.

You're all nodding.

We're not Gen Zers, but, you know, I mean, isn't that interesting, don't you think, sir?

Yeah.

For sure.

I remember when I, I took the permit test on my, my 16th birthday, and we got into the, neighborhood, and my mom said, all right, you get in the driver's driver's seat now, and I cried.

And so I think that was I cried.

Why?

I think I, I knew that this I don't want to be handling this three ton killing machine.

and now I love not having my own car.

it is definitely frees up my ability to save for other things that a lot of people my age can do.

do you look back and think, okay, that was a normal reaction of fear, or do you think, you know, we don't need to have that much anxiety.

We should just have like, I mean, that's a lot of anxiety.

No, I think it was a normal reaction of fear.

But in retrospect, I can create a fun story.

There you go.

Chaz, what do you make of Gen Z habits here?

What do you think?

I think it's very, appropriate.

And it just shows that we can't rely on the same methods.

decade after decade, I think I was, anti-caa activist before I knew what it was.

I would watch movies in New York City, but, like, it's so cool that they have, like, a subway.

I wish we had that.

Not realizing that we did.

And so, me and my brothers would ride our bikes down Holt Road in Webster, being terrified to try and just go to a store just so we could get out and do something when we were 14, because we wanted the freedom to just go do something and not just be in our neighborhood, in our cul de sac.

And so I think, yeah, it's it was something I always wish there were other options.

So it's nice to see young people say, why are we stuck in this car?

And it kind of combats that car's equal freedom narrative.

Anti-Caa activist I shouldn't say Anti-Caa site.

That's.

I'm not trying to box out cars.

I do use a car.

I own a car.

I think it's just, wanting choice is a better way to put it.

see, Howard Decker would not want you to couch that.

I mean, is Howard Decker still connected to this wonderful guy who?

We haven't talked to Howard in a while, and I hope he's doing well.

But Howard is never going to hesitate to tell us how many parking lots we have in the city, how many parking lots we have in our lives.

We don't need more pavement.

We don't need more cars.

You know, he would say, don't back off that.

And I think all that's to say is that I think there are many benefits to leaving the car behind.

But I also understand, you know, build a big tent.

I'm not trying to alienate anyone because that's also just on that topic.

I think people always say, oh, don't tell chairs I drove here or something.

I'm not antique.

Our car light is about, could this trip be something other than a car?

Absolutely.

And we're going to talk about how go ahead, sir.

in response to your and Howard's, point about all the parking lots, I have an exciting update since the last time I was here, where I used to live in downtown Rochester at Franklin and Pleasant Street, which is where, like Saint Joe's Park is, if people know it, that, four way stop is flanked on all four corners by surface level parking lots.

And that's where I hosted my first two parking day events.

Howard Decker was a special speaker there.

and in the time since then, there's now, housing development on one of those former surface parking lots.

So things are changing for the better.

Nobody ever saw a great piece of land.

It's like, you know what I can do with this?

Look at all the parking spaces I can put here.

Unfortunately, someone did say that.

yeah.

In this case, it's apparently a lot of people have said that, Steve Rule, what do you make of Gen Z's habits?

yeah.

I think it's great to be able to question, how we get around and not just go with the default option.

especially, cars are so expensive these days.

I think the average cost of car ownership is over $10,000 a year.

So if, if someone, if a family can go with one fewer cars in their lives, I mean, they can save a lot of money and have a lot more financial stability in their lives.

And I think that's, a huge thing.

So focusing on how do we get around, versus I need a car to get around?

Well, listeners, if, if you want to share your thoughts about being car light, car free, perhaps changing your habits, are you able to not use a car to get to work, to get to the store, maybe to get to your kids games wherever you're going?

or, you know, if you want to talk about, you know, maybe you've got, family, maybe you've got kids or Gen Z, maybe you've seen some of the shift in ideas.

Maybe you are Gen Z.

We've got plenty of Gen Z listeners and watchers here.

It's 844295 talk.

It's toll free.

84429582552636.

If you are calling from Rochester 2639994.

Or you can email the program connections at WXXI org.

You can join the chat if you're watching on YouTube and the Sky news YouTube channel.

You should be watching live with us from noon to two every afternoon.

Well, not on Saturdays and Sundays most of the time, but there we are.

So, we'd love to hear from you.

And I'm going to start with Steve.

I was reading Steve's story because Reconnect Rochester has, started collecting these stories about going car light and why people did so and, different circumstances.

So I mentioned off the top of the show back in 2019, you had a seizure.

And what do you what do you remember about that feeling?

You write a little bit about that in the piece, which I thought was interesting.

I mean, it was literally on your mind as you're going into the ambulance.

Tell me about that.

yeah.

So, I grew up with epilepsy.

I've had it since I was a kid, and, it's well controlled, so it just hasn't been an issue day to day, for years.

And then unfortunately, I had, had a seizure again back in 2019.

And I remember from my time when I was a teenager that, having a seizure here in New York, that means that you're not allowed to drive for at least six months.

And so as I basically regained consciousness, I mean, that was my first thought.

That was my first thing I was thinking about is I'm not going to be able to drive for at least six months, you know, how am I going to get around?

How am I going to go get groceries?

How am I going to run errands?

How am I just going to, like, live my life right?

And I realized that I didn't want to be stuck at home.

I didn't want to be dependent on my family and friends to, drive me around and, so I ended up, I got a bike, and for the first time as an adult, I was never a bike rider as an adult.

and then I also got a bus pass.

I learned how to use the bus.

And between the the bike and the bus, that really helped me maintain my independence during that time period.

And so I think that's something important.

when we only get around by car, you know, there are a lot of reasons why someone might lose that option.

whether it's from finances, say, a car suddenly breaks down a medical event or if if someone sort of ages out of driving.

So having different mobility options, is important on a personal level and in, as a community.

What is your transportation regimen these days?

yeah.

So I take, I take the bus a good amount, and I also bike a lot.

I actually did both coming out here.

So you can actually put a bike on, the front rack in the, and the bus at the front of the bus.

And so I took the bus to the transit center with my bike on it, because I was a little lazy this morning.

And then, I rode the rest of the way, and it's a great way to, use both of them.

How long did it take you after your seizure in 2019 to go from dreading what that meant for your transportation to thinking in a way, this might have been a good thing that this happened?

That's a great question.

I would say within a few months, I, I just, one of the things I've realized, riding around on a bike, is that whenever I finish a trip on a bike, I always feel better getting off of a bike and getting to my destination.

And I've never felt that way after, sitting in traffic and getting, to a parking spot.

And so that's something I really enjoyed.

And there's a good bike community, in this, city.

And, one of the things I found really helpful when I first got my bike is, I was quite nervous riding around on the streets in Rochester, as I'm sure anyone would be.

And, I took a bike class through, reconnect to Rochester.

Jesse Pierce, the cycling instructor, leads that, and it helps you understand how to ride your bike safely on the streets, along with other traffic.

And that really helped me out a ton.

And I felt a lot more confident and a lot more comfortable riding around, with my bike to say, go to the public market or go other places.

This didn't take long.

Pat wants to know you're riding your bike on a day like today, aren't you sweating when you get off the bike?

are you just have to be more conscious of the type of clothing that you're using, and you can always bike a little slower.

You don't need to be, in a race to get wherever you need to go.

You can ride a little slower.

You're not riding for the yellow jersey.

You're in the peloton.

You're good with the peloton.

We're not.

We not need to win this.

That's right.

We do not need to be sweating like we're in a breakaway.

Absolutely.

Okay.

you get used to it, though.

I mean, it sounds like Steve.

I mean, you can understand why Pat's asking, but you get into a rhythm, you get into a habit, a routine with it.

Yeah, yeah.

And, you just need to be a little bit more conscious of what you're going to be wearing.

And, one thing that, I'll say is that it's helpful to, not have too many layers on at first, because if you're riding a bike, you warm up pretty quickly 30, 37 and breezy today.

But I love it.

I mean, like, you're you're doing it.

so that Steve story and by the way, we're going to link to Steve.

Chaz.

And with the team at reconnect has been doing in our show notes, if you want to check that out, when this program gets posted on Sky news.org Dash connections later today, or to dash, I know what it is.

You know what I'm talking about.

Or wherever your podcasts are sold.

let me turn to Chaz Goodman, who is marketing and outreach manager for Reconnect Rochester.

Your situation was, a little different.

And, you know, you said you you've always preferred biking to driving.

and you spent most of your adult life, car free or car light until you had kids.

Yeah.

Take me through, some of the change and what you wanted.

People to understand in your piece for reconnect.

Yeah.

And also, just to add on to that question and, like, don't you get hotter, don't you sweat?

I think that is a big part of the narrative that we're trying to address with Reconnect Rochester is that there are so many people who think it's for young, able bodied people who are there to go for a race and who do like centuries, like hundred mile bike rides.

And that's just not the case.

I know people who bike in their business suits and just go there and, you know, it's just about regular people biking and making sure that anyone who wants to can.

So that's a big part of our mission is just to make sure.

So, hey, you don't have to sweat.

you can just have a nice, normal ride to work, and it's a great way to get outside on a beautiful day.

People unroll their window.

So what if you didn't have to have windows?

But.

And interestingly enough, you were used to that kind of routine.

Then you had kids and you start, you started flip and you started driving all the time.

Yeah.

So that was my story.

I so when I was 22, I moved to Chicago after college and just sort of brought my bike because my dad is a big, recreational cyclist, but he's also done cycle commuting, and he's like, you should bring your bike.

And I'm like, yeah, sure, I guess.

And then I remember I was going to a job interview and I was looking at like the instructions for the bus.

I'm like, I have to transfer busses.

I'm not sure how to do that.

So I just got on my bike and did that.

And like only a 22 year old can, I just went through the streets not thinking anything and just going, oh, this is fine and not really worrying about it.

And then by the time I was old enough to be, thinking, is this safe?

I was just very used to it.

And I realized it is safe as long as you are biking defensively.

And Jesse, I took Jesse's cycling class as well after I'd been a cycling commuter for nine years at that point, and I was like, oh, okay, this is really helpful because it took me nine years or so of just experience to see how to bike defensively and everything.

but then, yes, then I had kids and that's when I became just so much more aware of the stuff I'd been blissfully unaware of, which is that the infrastructure is lacking.

And, there are Rochester has good methods to get around, but we could always be doing better.

And when my two little boys are in that bike trailer, I want to make sure that they're safe.

how old are the boys other now?

Four and two.

So when they were each infants, I just didn't want to put an infant on a bicycle.

So I spent, you know, the last three or so years just driving them anytime I had to take them.

And, you know, like Steve said, I just feel better when I bike.

And it was just, hard for me because I.

And it's important to me to bike and I want them to see that.

So I'm really happy that I can show them how much it matters.

We're going to return in a moment to Chester.

There's an awesome story about what he heard his son saying in the trailer the other day before, before we get to that, though, you say that you've really had your eyes open to the lacking in infrastructure.

So let me ask all three of you, what do we need most that isn't necessarily the full list of pie in the sky, but realistically, if we're doing one thing to make infrastructure better right now, what is it?

I would say, flex posts, those are, you know, just sort of a border of some of some kind between the bike lane and the road itself.

This is a visual cue for drivers to give space.

You know, they don't want to scratch up their cars.

And it just shows that this is something that matters.

A the painted bike lanes are nice, but just something a little more concrete.

just to separate and show that this is something that matters.

Do you think sometimes drivers think that and bike lanes are nice?

Because that just gives me a little more room to go.

What I don't think very many are consciously thinking that, but I think it's not something I think, you know, it's something that they don't consider a huge barrier.

You're not in red along over there, Sara.

So what is the infrastructure change that's needed?

I would say smaller street design because, barrier is taken, but that would be part of it.

making the street smaller is something that, allows a driver, not even consciously to drive slower and drive more aware.

So I think I give an example of driving on, say, Park Avenue.

Park Avenue and Berkeley drivers naturally want to drive slow because slowly, because they don't want to hit a person or something that's coming out of the street.

Whereas like closer to where I live, going from, strong hospital to downtown on Mount Hope Avenue, there's, you can see very easily side to side.

And it's easy for cars to drive 45 and 50 miles an hour down this area that still has a lot of pedestrians.

I just want to build on that point before.

Let me just just make a you guys have already lit up the email.

So we're going to struggle to probably get everything in this hour, which is great.

we're talking to a team from Reconfigure Rochester about going car light and Sarah, when you talk about park as park, is it 25 miles an hour on Park Ave?

Most Park Avenue, or is it 30?

I don't think there's a 25 in the city.

Is it 30 or 35?

It's 30 across the city.

fortunately, there was just a state bill that passed that allowed towns and cities to unilaterally lower their speed limit.

So maybe in the future it'll be lower.

So, the reason I bring that up is, Park Avenue is not a straight line.

So when I drive it, I'm more conscious of being aware, looking for pedestrians, looking for people, crossing, understanding that it it doesn't loop, but it kind of drifts and turns a little bit.

so it's not a drag race, whereas I live in Charlotte and Lake Avenue, that's the drag race.

It's just you can see what the design of infrastructure does.

And Chaz wrote that you are more annoyed with road design than drivers.

Yeah.

So I think in many ways, you know, you can get angry at drivers, but they are part of a system that has encouraged cars to dominate, cars to go nuts as opposed to.

And I know that again, we're not going back to old Europe style pre automobile design, but well Sarah's going to but what was it.

What did you just mouth me.

Why not.

Why not.

Okay Europe is they're doing it.

They're going back from the mistakes of the Robert Moses era.

Okay.

Fair enough.

Charles, I just, I did want to say yes.

Like we definitely.

And that is, I am more focused on the design of our streets because, again, I'm not here to shame people for driving, and I understand why they drive.

I just also wanted to add, our cycling manager, Jesse, is always talking about the need to connect our bike spine network.

because we have lots of good bicycle boulevards, which are commerce streets that have speed humps and are safer bikers.

Or we have bike lanes, but they end and then they don't connect for a half mile or so in many places in the city.

So that's I just I know Jesse would say connect the spine.

That is our big ask.

Okay.

Go ahead Steve.

Yeah, I'll jump on that and say, I think that's probably the biggest thing that we need is really having a connected network of ideally protected bike lanes so that everyone of all ages and abilities can feel comfortable getting around.

I know that from my neighborhood.

I live over in the North Winton Village and on, East Main.

There's a segment up to about where the public market is, and I can ride on that on a nice cycle track, off of the road.

But then, then that ends right there, at Goodman, I think.

And so I can't take that way to actually go downtown, even though it's Main Street, because it just feels too dangerous.

And so I have to take a much more circuitous route around some of the neighborhoods down near Park Ave, which adds about another mile or so of riding and, where time.

And, that's the only way I can really get down there safely.

And so having a true network of, of a safe in for structure is really going to be the key.

Define a protected bike lane for people who don't bicycle.

yeah.

I'll give you an example.

So the, this last week, a few of us were down in in DC for the, the bike summit, the National Bike Summit, and, it was awesome riding around there, on a lot of their, their streets.

What were they had is, sort of like a two lane, two way, bike lane on the side of the road.

And there was, a small curb, like concrete curb separating the bike lane from the travel lanes.

And it made you feel very, safe and comfortable riding in, in that bike lane.

And, I think it would be a lot more comfortable as a driver as well, because you don't need to worry about, bicyclists kind of coming over into the travel lane.

They're in their lane, you're in your lane, and everyone can get along happily.

So I think that everyone who hates, passing a cyclist when they're driving should be a big proponent of protected bike lanes.

And also, it's better to have them on a bike than in a car.

Also contributing to traffic.

Absolutely.

Sarah, do you agree with Chad's point that it's more important to be annoyed with road design than drivers?

I do, yeah.

you know, a physician doesn't know it's in the sea or whatever.

yeah.

Our systems are built this way to have, you know, cars, you know, be aggressive.

And we continue to build out more and more infrastructure that supports car dependency and it's heart where we as cyclists and pedestrians and, you know, people waiting for the bus are just getting in drivers way.

the to where they need to go, I understand it.

Well, I want to read this story that Chaz shares in his piece for Reconnect Rochester.

You're right.

I heard my son in the trailer when you were bicycling.

Yeah, saying happy sad, mad mad sad, happy sad.

And I realized he was observing the facial expressions of people in their cars, and he said, sad and mad a lot.

And it got me thinking about how dehumanizing it is to be stuck in a car.

If someone cuts you off, you feel rage.

You don't think about them as a person.

You just see the big machines that you both have to operate.

You're angry because you could have easily been hurt.

Driving is a very high stakes activity.

And quote.

Boy is that the four year old three year old at the time, that's yeah, he was three at the time, three years old.

From the mouths of babes.

Sometimes the wisdom is hard to refute, isn't it?

It was.

Yeah.

It's incredible.

And it just that's what I was thinking of, is when I drive, I think that's part of like, I like being outside and getting the exercise on my bike.

But when I drive, I see other cars as an obstacle to a parking spot or an obstacle to making the green light or something, and you just don't view them as people.

But when you're biking with people I've, you know, gotten close to someone, it's like, oh, excuse me?

And they say, no problem, you know, because you see the person and I think there's a lot of value in that.

I mean, Louis C.K.

was right when he said, we are our worst selves when we're driving the way we talk to other human beings, we would never say things in person.

They couldn't if they could hear us.

The amount of cursing we do what other people just because now we might be 36 seconds later, getting home.

It's pretty remarkable.

but I just love that little vignette of your child observing happy but sad, mad, mad, sad sad mad.

He's very sharp.

Wow.

by the way, you were able to work out the best route to bike to daycare, and I know that's been a process for you.

How are things going with that now?

They're going great.

there is a bike lane on Elmwood in Brighton, so I live in Brighton and we go to the daycare on South Clinton.

They doodle bugs there, and there's a bike lane on Elmwood and I, I am the number one defender of that bike lane on the next door social media app.

because I know, you know, I think there are some people who are frustrated when it was going in, and I just want to at least be a voice to say, this really matters to us.

And, it's been transformative.

And it was perfect timing.

Just as my boys are getting old enough to ride in the bike trailer, and then we cut through lock de Ville rather than deal with that intersection at South Clinton and Elmwood, which is just a little dicey, Sarah jokes.

What is your typical routine now as a car like person?

Yeah, my typical routine is I in the colder months, I take the bus to work every day.

and I'm very fortunate that my employer gives us free bus passes.

So if you work for the city of Rochester, go get your free bus pass.

so I'm save so much money that way.

And I am so fortunate.

But I also, like, live my life intentionally so that I can live somewhere where I could take the bus to work every day.

so I just take one bus, and then I bike, and I walk in the warmer months, and then I started doing some, like, winter sports activities, and that's what I have to drive out to the suburbs in a car for.

I do that like three times a week.

I wish I could bike, but it's just, you know, it's late and it's cold and icy.

any idea how many miles a year you drive in these days?

Oh, so 20 times 50.

Probably 1500 miles.

And that's not a lot of miles.

Okay.

Yeah, I don't maybe it feels like a lot to you.

That is not a lot of miles.

you know, that's the definition of car light.

Is there anything that, besides winter?

activities that you talked about?

Is there anything that has been more difficult than others?

are you able to get to stores?

Are you able to do things that you need to, errands and things?

Yeah.

So I'm fortunate, that I wasn't that fortunate, but I have a different life from, say, jazz, where I don't have, dependents who rely on me.

So I can also, like, just grab one bag of groceries on the way home from work three days a week, as opposed to doing one massive haul once a week.

and I just it's this way that I've decided to live my life.

I kind of, like, end up living a smaller life.

I don't need as much stuff.

I don't need to go do a a hall at Walmart.

I don't have anywhere to put that haul.

so I just kind of changed my life to make it work.

Although the bike trailer does have a trunk with plenty of room for grocery bags too, so it sounds like someone who's done it once or twice.

Yeah.

I also want to, make sure that we're not forgetting about people who for whom like, biking isn't really the easiest.

So we do have while our our bus system is pretty bad as far as systems go.

it is it works for a lot of people.

And I think one thing that none of the three of us said as our one thing that we would like to see, but I'm sure we all think about, is, like massively improving and continuing to fund, the RTA system and making sure that, you know, drivers there are there's enough operators to carry out like a well-functioning system.

so RTA is continually improving.

I think on demand is a really cool thing for people who live far away, but like still want to try out public transit.

And I know that like, they're having trouble getting enough operators.

And so this this is all bigger than just like what somebody wants to do, or somebody might even want to try taking the bus, but they don't.

There aren't enough B bus operators or something.

So there's the idea of being car light is supported by all of these factors.

And it's not just street design that is holding us back.

Well, here's an email from Alex on kind of on that subject.

Alex writes, it's the same push we've seen with plant based diets.

60% of households bought plant based food within the last year, but only about 4% of Americans self-identify as vegetarian.

People will choose these options if they're available and good to bad.

Breaking our car habits requires more infrastructure than that.

New York City's recent free fare pilot study showed a 30% jump in ridership, with almost half of riders doing so for leisure.

You have to remove barriers to entry.

Sarah.

So something that I've been kicking myself about since I was last on your show is that I didn't have a response to something that you said, which was that then board president of reconnect would love to see people riding the bus in suits, and I don't know why I had a knee jerk reaction that that wasn't quite right.

And I don't think that would be exactly what she thought anyway.

but, we want people in suits to ride the bus.

Yes, but it's the fact that the barrier to entry, is so high because it's so inconvenient that why they would just choose to drive.

We need to make the system in Rochester work for everyone, typically the most marginalized people.

And that will allow the system to be the great system that it can be.

And then anyone's going to want to ride the bus because it's great.

It's the best alternative.

What do you think, Steve?

yeah.

And I would say, I've heard in the bus a couple times with the suit.

So it's, it can be a great way to get downtown if you have, an event going on downtown, you just jump on the bus and it takes you right down there.

And no need to worry about parking or paying for parking.

Well, we now have a small mountain of email correspondence and, YouTube comments on the YouTube chat from the news YouTube page for people watching along on there.

We got to get our only break of the hour.

We're going to come back.

We're going to take your feedback.

We're going to tell you about a Wednesday meeting that they want you to know about New Yorkers for Transportation equity, if you're interested in that.

And again, we're going to link to some of the pieces that our guests have put together for you to think about a car light lifestyle.

Chaz Goodman Steve role with Reconnect Rochester Sarah Jenks is back with us.

So Rochester resident and this is our only break of the hour.

I'm Evan Dawson Tuesday on the next connections mushroom coffee, vitamin A, the keto diet.

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Social media influencers want to tell you what to eat or what not to eat.

But what do dietitians say they will put some truth to the conversation and help us sort it all out.

Then, in our second hour, Rochester is home to a number of resources that can support families with medically fragile children.

We'll talk about them with our guests.

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This is connections.

We're getting a lot to squeeze in in the last 20 minutes or so here.

First of all, Steve, in our brief break Steve role from Reconnect Rochester was mentioning that you can use Google Maps to do what?

yeah.

If you, plug in your work or, some destination that you usually go to, you can, push a little button to see what it would be like to take public transit there versus the car directions or bike directions as well.

And you can easily see if it would be, convenient, easy, route to take a bus on.

And so that's a good idea if you want if you're curious about this, it's pretty helpful.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

and then if you do want to use the bus some time, the transit app is, is a good way to use that.

You can buy a bus pass on there, and you use that to just jump on the bus.

and before, right before we came back here, Chaz, you wanted to jump in there, too?

Just a quick comment.

And that I've spoken to.

you know, I know our bus system is actually one of the more affordable ones in the country, and, they are reliable for their schedule.

They have.

What we really would like to see is more frequency, restoring more of that 15 minute service, even building towards 5 or 10 minute service.

So you don't even have to check the schedule to go.

But, it's $3 a day capped, so you can't spend more than $3 a day to ride the bus, which is pretty incredible and pretty accessible.

So we just want to make sure they're frequent, pretty important information there okay, a lot of feedback.

Let's get through.

we're going to go rapidly here Bob says, hey, Evan, whenever I've gone to a place with a pedestrian mall, I've come back wanting the same thing here.

Think if it could Commons or Church Street Marketplace in Burlington.

Is anyone around here working on such a thing?

What could I do to help make that happen?

It's a good question, Chaz.

What do you think I would say?

Yes.

I think that is the best, thing to do.

It shows people.

I mean, these are tourist destinations where people go to walk around.

They drive their cars to somewhere so they can walk around.

So these are hi.

I literally did it last summer at the Commons and I loved spending time there.

It's incredible.

I will say, we have a weekly, mobility action alert.

So you can sign up for on our website, Reconnect Rochester Dawg.

And every week we send out an email saying the city government or the government is considering this.

Here's how you can help.

And if you want to get more pedestrian spaces, that is the place to find out about it.

Our advocacy team is very on top of all of the initiatives happening.

Yeah.

I mean, I mean, even thinking of Linden Street in Geneva, which isn't, you know, is mostly often, free of cars.

It's a wonderful place to walk.

There's multiple businesses, place to grab a bite or a drink.

it's not as big as the Commons, Bob, but for sure Geneva has taken that on board and said, we want more of this, so.

But you gotta you gotta advocate for it.

Yeah.

We're building an army of people who care about this stuff are not building, and we're building a good group of people who care about this.

I mean, an army is fine.

But anyway, yeah, Chester got toned down my militant language that's there.

I think there are two existing or upcoming projects in downtown Rochester that might be of interest to Bob and I think my suggestion for anyone who has any interest in advocating is just kind of like, see what exists now, go to a public meeting or see if you can, you know, get an invite to a private meeting and see how people talk about these things.

And, so you can have work on your own toolbox as our advocating for things.

So I know there's one project that, is connected with Rock the River way that would be maybe Broad Street, Port Street.

Does anyone remember which bridge?

Yes.

The, rock.

The aqueduct.

Yeah, yeah, it's on Broad Street.

Yeah.

So there's a broad street.

So, Yeah.

Look up, online about if there are any public meetings coming up or if you, you know, just want to talk to people about how they're advocating for that.

And then there's another one.

I think at Main in Clinton, people have it's just a development parcel.

those buildings that are being re built where it used to be, like Dixie Wiggs many years ago.

And there's maybe a pedestrian mall going to be nearby there, which I think would be cool near the transit center.

as long as people's, you know, existing needs are still met and important buildings aren't going away.

Anything to add there, Steve?

no.

But I guess I would say that I, I love those types of places too.

And it's, it's amazing when people go on vacation to other places or, you know, go to Disney World, right?

Disney World is a car free place, and people are walking around and loving it.

And and people want to see more of those types of, opportunities and places.

Mary says my mom is 91 years old in Japan.

She has never learned to drive because she can go anywhere by bus or train.

She walks to grocery stores, keeps herself healthy because of her daily physical activities.

If we have decent and reliable public transportation in the United States, it is easy for seniors to go around and live by themselves.

And she says, by the way, my mom lives in a town of 200,000 people.

It's not very populated, but the transportation is sufficient.

Designed Rochester's roughly 200,000.

So that's a pretty good analog there.

And that is a 91 year old resident who's never needed to own a car, never needed to go ahead, sir.

Yeah.

Based on what Steve said about traveling and what you just said about Japan, I think that, international travel is a great entree into learning about urbanism, learning about walking and biking and accessible modes of transit.

like when you go somewhere else, maybe you're already feeling adventurous.

You're in, Italy or something.

Maybe now is a time when you could try taking a bus or a light rail.

and see how it's how cities that are similar in size to Rochester are investing in transit in ways that, you know, we just aren't in New York State.

And it's pretty eye opening experience.

Steve.

Yeah, I would just add, you know, especially over the next decade or two, you know, more and more Americans are going to probably age out of driving or want to be in places where they don't need to be reliant on a car and, having more walkable neighborhoods, having more, transit, more of those types of options, mobility options will help people to, live without needing a car.

Chaz, just one quick thing, doctor Scott McCrea, who's a big supporter of Reconnect Rochester.

He always likes to say you're safer on your bike than on your couch.

So people who get nervous about biking, it's such a health consideration, and it's a good way to just get your exercise.

And that's the key to longevity.

so let me get back to the YouTube chat here.

There's a bunch, and I'll try to squeeze in as much as we can.

If you've emailed, we'll try to get a lot in here.

DMs says a couple things more bus shelters would be helpful, and having Wi-Fi service on the bus would also be great.

And outlets to plug in.

Okay, that's on the menu of of asks for arts and when their CEO is back with us on the program soon, we'll bring those up.

Everybody agree with those needs are key.

Like standing next to a pole, with no seating is tough.

Yeah, especially in the elements.

Yeah.

Okay.

DM thank you for that.

on YouTube, a commenter is more critical of arts is on demand.

says it hasn't been, reliable.

I so I just want to ask if our guests have used the on demand arts service, have had similar or different experience?

Sarah, I use it pretty.

maybe I try to use it once a month, and I'm.

I am.

When it first started, I was very successful, and I was a huge proponent of on demand.

You can also put your bike on the front of an on demand vehicle, just like with a typical RTA bus.

So it really opens up like all of Monroe County.

However, these days I, I've heard, word on the street is that they are low on operators and so it is.

Even if one tries to schedule 24 hours in advance, they're often just isn't availability.

But it is an amazing service.

If it were to be able to actually serve in the way that it's intended, I think it would also be a really nice starting point for folks who live in the suburbs to try public transit.

so when it's working, it's amazing.

But I hear about callers complaints.

Okay, you guys experienced to share there.

I haven't used on demand, myself.

I mean, that might be a good way to try something out.

I've always used the the fixture out, I guess normal bus, you might say.

And, so I think if you are near a bus route, that's probably the way to go because you, you won't need to worry about, delays or, not being able to get in on demand.

Maybe this needs this is the next WXXI investigation.

We should do.

See how on demand doing.

I know they're committed to to doing it well, but we'll see.

a different comment, on the YouTube chat, a viewer says it's usually going somewhere by car, 15 minutes taking the transit.

One hour and 15 minutes.

Yeah, yeah.

absolutely.

And so this is one of the big issues here in, in Rochester.

And I'll share, about a month ago, I had to get down to, an appointment at Clinton Crossings, and, we had gotten some snowfall.

and the roads were kind of slushy and gross, and I just, I'm not that hardcore.

I didn't want to bike it.

And, so I ended up having to take the bus in what would have been a nice, ten minute drive or maybe, you know, 15 minute bike ride.

It was, about an hour and ten minutes.

And so, that is the challenge with transit here.

sometimes, it can just be almost as fast as driving, but, if you have to, take, a transition at, like, the transit center, then it can be an hour.

And, and so, yeah, transit needs to be better and more frequent here.

Frequency is our ask.

Definitely.

Tess, right on a couple of subjects.

Points to what's going on in Europe.

I mean, you heard Sarah say early this hour.

Why can't we design it the way Europe is doing it?

You can.

Design is a choice.

Test points to a piece from Streetsblog by Ben Friede on the origin of Holland.

Stop murdering children.

Street safety movement.

I'm going to read a little bit from this.

Since the 1970s, the Netherlands and the United States have taken different paths when it comes to engineering streets.

While the Dutch tackled traffic deaths and injuries by designing local streets where walking and biking are safe, convenient ways to get around, the prevalent approach in America was to ply to apply highway design principles to local streets.

Wider and straighter was thought to be safer.

The superiority of the Dutch approach turned out to be dramatic.

In 1975, the traffic death rate in the Netherlands was 20% higher than in America, but by 2008 it was 60% lower.

About 22,000 fewer people would die on us streets each year if the nation had achieved safety outcomes comparable to the Dutch remarkable and again straight line streets designed like grids and highways to accommodate automobile traffic did not turn out to be safer for pedestrians.

I mean, the data is really clear now.

You're making me sound like an anti-caa activist.

Chad.

Well, it's contagious.

but I appreciate test sending that bit of historical data.

And Tess says the following about biking in Europe.

She says that after decades of biking in Rochester, I'm biking these days in Switzerland.

There is absolutely tension here between motorists and bicyclists.

But here, the very blunt campaign to stop child murder on our roadways began in the 1970s.

It's brought about changes in infrastructure like protected bike lanes, and that has made all the difference.

So test says Europe's not magical.

There's still tension and cars are still sometimes in tension with drivers.

But it's about culture, education and design.

So absolutely.

And, you know, safety is a big thing here.

You know, Rochester has put out a Vision Zero plan.

And, one thing to remember is that when, bike lanes go in and protected bike lanes go in, they make the whole system safer.

They make it safer for bicyclists, pedestrians and drivers alike.

And, in, in the U.S. and in, Rochester in particular.

pedestrian deaths are at really pretty, pretty stark highs.

I know I believe Rochester has, the top, pedestrian in deaths per capita, I think, or traffic deaths per capita in for, cities in the New York.

And that's one of the reasons why, the mayor is, trying to lead on Vision Zero.

Okay.

Just wanted to clarify, because I've talked about visions here, and some people have questions.

That's the goal of zero traffic deaths in a year.

And it and some people have said that's impossible.

But it has happened in new Jersey.

It has happened in Oregon.

And it is definitely possible to have zero traffic deaths.

And that is part of what we're trying to change is just not accepting traffic deaths as an inevitability because it's not.

Yeah, I'll I'll add to that.

I mean, let's think about how we think about, air traffic safety.

Right.

If a plane goes down, it is a huge deal.

And it should be.

And, people go in to figure out what are the root causes.

Why did this happen?

Not trying to point blame, but trying to figure out what caused this to happen.

You don't think we would point blame and air traffic problems now?

Anyway, that's a whole separate thing.

I think what Steve means is ideally, we don't just throw blame.

Go ahead.

Yeah, absolutely.

But, we certainly don't do that with traffic, fatalities.

You know, we see that that drip, drip, drip of, daily, you know, deaths and traffic crashes in Rochester and in New York and, it's just, people just, are kind of numb to it.

And either you blame the individual, but not the system or exac, or you kind of just go, oh, it's another accident.

I get mad at the road design.

Yeah, yeah.

Sir, I want to thank the viewer.

Tess, who brought up the study between Netherlands and the United States because it really shows how modern these decision making processes are.

you know, earlier, Evan joked about old European cities like, city planning didn't stop in Europe since, like, these cities were built in the medieval times.

I think a lot about, small cities in France, cities that are smaller than City of Rochester by population and similar in population density.

There's been a massive push for installing fixed routes like even light rails across all across these smaller cities in France in the past 15 years.

So these are decisions that we can make now.

We can still turn things around and make life safe and accessible without a car can, says Evan.

If you haven't seen the documentary Who Killed the Electric Car?

It's pretty interesting explaining how big oil suppressed public transportation, as well as snuffing out EVs in the 1980s.

That is from Ken, Jason says.

I was car free for almost a year in Rochester, and my partner and I have been a one car household for many years.

Does that qualify as car light?

Absolutely.

Yeah, okay.

He says it's possible, but not easy to be car free.

In Rochester.

I had the luxury of being relatively affluent.

I could afford Uber or Lyft when necessary.

I was also single and childless.

I cannot imagine being car free with children or without the privilege of having relative affluence.

Also, my advice to Americans do not go to Europe, particularly the Netherlands.

They're incredible.

Biking and walking infrastructure will forever ruin the United States for you.

That is.

Jason, I do want to point the some of the there are some cities in the US that are doing.

I'm making some good strides.

So it's nice to see that at home to Jason.

Thank you.

Adrian says we're car light in 2022.

My sister's car finally died.

And so my wife and I sold one of our two cars to her.

We've been car light one car since.

We have three kids 11, eight and four.

Our plan was, let's say if we can do this for a year, things have made this possible biking year round to work and wherever else a mother in law helps out by bringing kids to extracurriculars a couple times a week.

Living in the city, we're both close to our jobs, groceries and errands.

On that note, I'm going to ask Sarah Jenks if you want to give two suggestions for going car light.

What would you tell people?

take baby steps.

First of all, if you want to try taking transit, for example, pick a day when you don't have anything going on and there's nothing on the line if you, you know, if it doesn't work out, try going somewhere.

If you live in the city, you can get downtown on the bus in one ride.

Try that.

And then second is, when you travel internationally or even around the United States, travel with the idea of what if I'm walking here and I'm comfortable?

What's making me feel comfortable?

If I'm not comfortable, what is it?

What would make me want to walk more?

Well said.

And if you want to, port, what's going on on Wednesday night?

If you're interested, at 630 and Wednesday night, there is a meeting for the New Yorkers for transportation equity chairs.

What is that?

So, they are a organization in New York that is trying to offer people choice in mobility.

So you have options beyond the car.

And again, all this car light.

It's not shaming drivers.

It's just saying are there alternatives.

And we spend so much money on highway expansions.

So their specific ask here is to stop putting more money into highway expansions.

We can maintain our existing roads, but considering multi-modal options meaning public transit and bike infrastructure.

so yeah, they have a general meeting and you can just look up the New Yorkers for transportation equity and, look up and they have a meeting on Wednesday at 630 that it's a great way to get started.

Call your state reps and make sure they support it.

I'll close with this from David, who's listening in Vancouver, Canada, on the mobile app.

He says, back in 2006, I decided to retire my car.

I bought an electric assisted bike.

He says, hey, Vancouver is hilly and no sweat was the huge advantage.

And I bought a monthly bus and train pass.

I signed up for a car share services while thinking I would occasionally need a car.

I've discovered just how good Vancouver transit is, and to this day, I've never rented a car at all.

I wish Rochester could be that lucky.

Thank you Dave.

thank you David.

a nice little coda to the hour.

If you want to learn more about a car light lifestyle, we'll link on our show notes.

To what?

Reconnect Rochester has put together.

You'll learn more from Steve Rawl, who's a board member.

Thanks for being here, Steve.

Absolutely.

Thanks.

Chaz Goodman, a marketing and outreach manager for Reconnect Rochester, wearing the coolest shirt in town.

Thank you Chaz.

Thank you.

And thanks to Sarah Jenks of Rochester resident.

Nice to see you back here.

Good to see you too, from the whole team at connections.

Thank you for listening.

Thank you for watching on the Sexy News YouTube channel.

We are back with you tomorrow on member supported public media.

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