[ THEME MUSIC ] WELCOME TO THIS WEEK'S EDITION OF "NEW YORK NOW."

I'M DAN CLARK.

ON THIS WEEK'S SHOW, WE'RE FOCUSING ENTIRELY ON MENTAL HEALTH IN NEW YORK, AND I WANT TO SAY UP FRONT THAT THERE AREN'T A LOT OF VISUALS IN THIS SHOW, AND THAT'S BECAUSE THERE IS NO VISUAL FOR MENTAL HEALTH.

IT'S THE WOMAN YOU SEE AT THE GROCERY STORE WHO IS STRUGGLING TO MAKE ENDS MEET.

IT'S THE MAN ON THE SIDEWALK GRIEVING THE LOSS OF A PARENT.

IT'S THAT PERSON IN THE DOCTOR'S OFFICE WHO JUST LOOKS EXHAUSTED.

IT'S THE CHILD WHO CAN'T FOCUS AT SCHOOL BECAUSE OF WHAT'S GOING ON AT HOME.

SEE, MENTAL HEALTH IS EVERYWHERE AND IT AFFECTS EVERYONE NO MATTER THEIR INCOME, THEIR RACE, WHERE THEY LIVE, WHAT THEY DO, IT IMPACTS ALL OF US.

SOME ARE BETTER OFF THAN OTHERS.

WE KNOW THAT PEOPLE OF COLOR ARE LESS LIKELY TO RECEIVE MENTAL HEALTH SERVICES, FOR EXAMPLE.

ACCORDING TO DATA FROM KFF, WHICH COVERS HEALTH POLICY, 52% OF WHITE PEOPLE WITH A MENTAL ILLNESS IN THE U.S. GOT HELP WITH THEIR MENTAL HEALTH AS OF TWO YEARS AGO.

THAT'S THE LATEST DATA WE HAVE.

THAT'S COMPARED TO 39% FOR BLACK PEOPLE.

36% FOR HISPANIC PEOPLE AND 25% FOR ASIAN PEOPLE.

AND THAT'S FOR A LOT OF REASONS, FROM ACCESS TO MENTAL HEALTH CARE, INCOME, AND A LOT MORE.

SO THE STATE HAS TRIED TO HELP WITH THAT INVESTING A RECORD $1 BILLION INTO MENTAL HEALTH IN THE LATEST STATE BUDGET.

THAT'S TO BUILD NEW HOUSING FOR PEOPLE WITH MENTAL HEALTH NEEDS, MORE MENTAL HEALTH SERVICES IN SCHOOLS AND MORE.

BUT A BOOST IN SPENDING IN NEXT YEAR'S BUDGET COULD BE OFF THE TABLE.

GOVERNOR KATHIE HOCHUL HAS NOW TOLD STATE AGENCIES TO HOLD THE LINE ON ANY NEW SPENDING PROPOSALS AHEAD OF NEXT YEAR, BUT ALSO TOLD ME THIS WEEK THAT CUTS TO MENTAL HEALTH WOULDN'T BE HAPPENING.

THAT IS SUCH A HUGE PRIORITY AND IT AFFECTS PEOPLE IN SO MANY DIFFERENT WAYS.

IT AFFECTS OTHER ISSUES.

WE HAVE SO MANY PEOPLE THAT YOU WOULD NOT EXPECT, PEOPLE THAT ARE NOT ACCUSTOMED TO ASKING FOR HELP WHO NEED HELP.

WE'RE JUST GETTING WARMED UP IN THAT SPACE.

I'LL NEVER COMPROMISE IN THAT.

IT'S SO CRITICAL.

NOW THAT DOESN'T NECESSARILY MEAN THAT CHANGES IN FUNDING WON'T HAPPEN.

HOCHUL WILL PRESENT HER BUDGET PROPOSAL IN JANUARY, BUT SHE'LL NEGOTIATE A FINAL SPENDING PLAN INTO THE SPRING AND THE STATE LEGISLATURE HAS ALSO SHOWN AN INTEREST IN MENTAL HEALTH IN THE PAST FEW YEARS.

SO WE'LL WATCH THAT FIGHT NEXT YEAR.

BUT FIRST, WE WANTED TO LEARN MORE THIS WEEK ABOUT HOW THE STATE SEES MENTAL HEALTH, THE CHALLENGES THAT STILL EXIST AND WHAT PEOPLE SHOULD DO IF THEY NEED HELP.

SO WE TURNED TO DR. ANNE MARIE SULLIVAN, THE COMMISSIONER OF THE STATE OFFICE OF MENTAL HEALTH.

[ THEME MUSIC ] DR. SULLIVAN, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

I APPRECIATE IT.

SO MENTAL HEALTH I VIEW AS ONE OF THE BIGGEST PROBLEMS IN SOCIETY TODAY.

I'M LOOKING AT IT FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF ME, MY MENTAL HEALTH PROBLEMS, SOCIETY, PANDEMIC COMING OUT OF IT, A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS HAPPENING IN THE LAST DECADE, I THINK.

HOW DO YOU VIEW MENTAL HEALTH IN SOCIETY TODAY?

WELL, IT IS DEFINITELY A VERY IMPORTANT ISSUE.

YEAH.

MENTAL HEALTH HAS ALWAYS BEEN AN IMPORTANT ISSUE, BUT I THINK IT WAS IN THE SHADOWS MANY YEARS BEFORE.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT IS HAPPENING NOW IS PEOPLE ARE MORE AWARE, WHICH I THINK IS TERRIFIC, BUT MENTAL HEALTH ESPECIALLY POST THE PANDEMIC, WE KNOW THERE'S BEEN SIGNIFICANT INCREASE IN DEPRESSION, ANXIETY, POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS SINCE THE PANDEMIC.

ALMOST AN INCREASE OF 40% OF NEW YORKERS PROBABLY HAVE SOME SEQUELAE FROM THE PANDEMIC.

THAT'S SIGNIFICANT.

WE ALSO HAVE INDIVIDUALS WHO HAVE MENTAL HEALTH PROBLEMS THAT GOT WORSE DURING THE PANDEMIC.

YES.

SO YES, IT'S A VERY BIG CHALLENGE RIGHT NOW BUT THE GOOD THING IS THAT I THINK PEOPLE ARE MUCH MORE OPEN TO ASKING FOR HELP THAN THEY'VE EVER BEEN BEFORE.

I THINK SO, TOO.

AND I THINK WE ARE TALKING ABOUT AND WHAT YOU'RE REALLY HONING IN ON IS THE TRAUMA FROM THE PANDEMIC.

I THINK TRAUMA COMES FROM A LOT OF PLACES, THE PANDEMIC, LIFE AT HOME, KIDS IN SCHOOLS DEALING WITH MASS SHOOTINGS, THINGS LIKE THAT.

WHAT DO WE DO ABOUT THAT MOVING FORWARD?

I MEAN, HOW DO WE TACKLE THAT?

IT'S SUCH A BIG PROBLEM.

IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO FOCUS ON PREVENTION WITH MENTAL HEALTH.

YES.

BECAUSE THERE'S ALWAYS GOING TO BE TRAUMAS AND EVERYONE'S TRAUMA CAN BE VERY DIFFERENT, BUT BASICALLY IT'S ALWAYS GOING TO BE THERE.

SO HOW DO WE PREVENT THE LONG-TERM SEQUELAE?

I THINK THERE, YOU BEGIN WITH YOUTH AND YOU BEGIN TO WORK WITH KIDS IN SCHOOLS.

YOU BEGIN TO WORK WITH PEDIATRICIANS AND THEIR FAMILIES THAT ARE UNDER STRESS AND YOU BEGIN TO OFFER THEM MENTAL HEALTH SUPPORTS THAT THEY NEED SO THAT YOU DON'T HAVE PROLONGED TRAUMA, PROLONGED STRESS BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT THE LONG-TERM EFFECTS OF THAT CAN BE MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES IN ADULTHOOD.

ABOUT SO TELL ME WHAT WE'RE DOING AROUND CHILDREN.

I KNOW THAT WE HAVE SOME FUNDING GOING TOWARD MORE SUPPORT IN SCHOOLS AND MORE SUPPORT OUTSIDE OF SCHOOLS.

CAN YOU TALK ABOUT WHAT WE'RE DOING TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN?

ONE OF OUR MAJOR INITIATIVES RIGHT NOW IS TO HAVE MENTAL HEALTH CLINICS ACTUALLY IN THE SCHOOLS AND TO GROW THAT.

WE HAVE ABOUT A THOUSAND IN THE SCHOOLS ACROSS NEW YORK STATE NOW AND WE'RE GOING TO BE ADDING ANOTHER 200 TO 300 THIS YEAR.

THE MENTAL HEALTH CLINICS PROVIDE SUPPORT FOR THE YOUTH, FOR THE PARENTS AND ALSO FOR THE TEACHERS SO THAT THEY FIND A YOUTH WHO THEY FEEL HAS SOME ISSUES, THEY CAN TALK TO MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONALS.

THAT YOUTH CAN GET SOME SERVICE RIGHT THERE IN THE SCHOOL IN A NON-STIGMATIZING WAY.

IT'S A MAJOR INITIATIVE TO HAVE THOSE SERVICES AVAILABLE.

NOW IF SOMEONE SHOULD NEED MORE INTENSIVE SERVICES, THEN THEY CAN CONNECT TO COMMUNITY-BASED SERVICES.

THE OTHER BIG THING WE HAVE IS THIS 988 NUMBER.

YES.

988 IS A COUNSELING LINE.

IT'S ALSO A CRISIS LINE, BUT A COUNSELING LINE.

IF YOU CALL 988 FOR ANY KIND OF MENTAL HEALTH CRISIS, BIG OR SMALL, YOU'LL GET SOMEONE TO TALK TO.

THE AVERAGE TIME ON THE LINE IS 25 MINUTES.

REALLY?

YES.

I WOULD ASSUME MOST PEOPLE WOULD SPEND TWO MINUTES AND MAYBE HANG UP.

NO.

TWENTY-FIVE MINUTES TALKING TO SOMEONE IS THE AVERAGE TIME, AND PEOPLE HAVE THE ABILITY TO OFTEN RESOLVE WHATEVER THE ISSUE IS IN THAT PHONE CALL.

IF NOT, THEY CAN GET A REFERRAL TO SERVICES.

24/7 AVAILABLE IN MULTIPLE LANGUAGES AND IN SOME DIALECTS, IT MIGHT BE THROUGH A TELEPHONE LANGUAGE LINE, BUT YOU CAN CALL AND YOU CAN GET SERVICES, AND THEY WILL CONNECT WITH YOU PERSONALLY ABOUT WHAT YOUR ISSUES ARE.

SO 24/7, ANYONE CAN CALL 988 OR TEXT, CALL OR TEXT.

THEY CAN TEXT AND THEY WILL HAVE A TEXT CONVERSATION WITH SOMEBODY.

YEP.

THEY WON'T GET A CALL BACK OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT?

NO, TEXT YOU GET JUST A TEXT CONVERSATION.

CAN YOU TALK TO ME ABOUT THE SERVICES THEY MIGHT BE REFERRED TO ON 988 IF THEY CALL AND THE PROVIDER OR PERSON THEY'RE TALKING TO SAYS, I WANT TO CONNECT YOU WITH SOMETHING ELSE?

I THINK YOU NEED MORE THAN THIS PHONE CALL.

WHAT ARE THE OPTIONS?

THERE'S A WHOLE RANGE OF OPTIONS DEPENDING ON WHAT THE ISSUES ARE.

YEAH.

SO WE HAVE A VERY SUBSTANTIAL CLINIC SYSTEM, WHERE YOU CAN GET TO TALK TO A THERAPIST ABOUT A PROBLEM.

WE HAVE WHAT WE CALL CERTIFIED COMMUNITY BEHAVIORAL HEALTH CENTERS WHERE YOU CAN WALK IN AND GET SERVICES IMMEDIATELY.

IF YOU NEED TO SEE SOMEONE IN PERSON BECAUSE THE CRISIS IS PRETTY CHALLENGING AND YOU NEED TO TALK TO SOMEONE RIGHT AWAY, WE HAVE MOBILE CRISIS TEAMS THAT CAN GO OUT AND MEET WITH YOU.

SO YOU CAN HAVE SOMEONE COME TO TALK WITH YOU OR YOU CAN GET A REFERRAL, OR YOU CAN CALL BACK THE CRISIS LINE AGAIN.

WHATEVER REALLY IS THE NEED OF THE INDIVIDUAL WHO IS CALLING.

SO I WANT TO ZOOM OUT FOR A SECOND AWAY FROM CRISIS, CALLING 988 AND JUST TALK ABOUT SOMEBODY WHO MAY BE EXPERIENCING MENTAL HEALTH CHALLENGES, THEY DON'T FEEL THAT THEY'RE IN CRISIS OR NEED IMMEDIATE TREATMENT.

IF SOMEBODY IS STRUGGLING WITH THEIR MENTAL HEALTH, WHAT SHOULD THE FIRST STEP BE?

WHAT SHOULD THEY DO?

I THINK IT CAN VARY PERSON TO PERSON.

SOME PEOPLE FEEL COMFORTABLE TALKING WITH THEIR PRIMARY CARE DOCTOR.

YEAH.

THE DOCTOR THEY SAY.

YOU GO IN AND SAY, I'M HAVING SOME PROBLEMS AND MOST PRIMARY CARE DOCTORS ARE VERY GOOD AT TALKING TO YOU AND KIND OF DECIDING TOGETHER WHETHER YOU WANT FURTHER HELP OR NOT.

IT CAN ALSO CALL 988.

YOU CAN TALK TO-- IF YOU'RE A STUDENT, YOU CAN TALK WITH A TEACHER.

YOU CAN TALK WITH A TRUSTED ADULT OFTEN IF YOU ARE YOUTH, SOMEONE YOU FEEL YOU CAN TALK TO ABOUT THINGS.

MAIN THING IS IF YOU'RE FEELING-- YOU CAN TALK TO YOUR PARENTS SOMETIMES.

SOMETIMES KIDS HAVE A LITTLE MORE TROUBLE TALKING TO PARENTS.

YEAH.

WHEN WE DO TOURS ACROSS THE STATE, YOUTH ALSO TALKED TO OTHER YOUTH.

SO WE'RE GETTING THE WORD OUT TO YOUTH ABOUT HOW TO HELP EACH OTHER AND HOW TO ACCESS SERVICES.

IT'S SOMETHING CALLED YOUTH MENTAL HEALTH FIRST AID WHICH HELPS YOUTH UNDERSTAND HOW TO HELP EACH OTHER WITH MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES BECAUSE THAT'S OFTEN THE FIRST PERSON A YOUTH WOULD GO TO.

THE FIRST TIME I ACTUALLY SOUGHT HELP FOR MY MENTAL HEALTH CONDITIONS, I WENT TO MY PRIMARY DOCTOR AS YOU MENTIONED.

HE HAD REFERRED ME TO A THERAPIST.

I DEPART WORK OUT WITH THAT THERAPIST.

WE JUST WEREN'T A GOOD MATCH.

TRYING TO FIND A THERAPIST AFTER THAT WAS SUCH A CHALLENGE.

I HEAR THIS ALL THE TIME FROM PEOPLE WHO SAY THIS THERAPIST WON'T TAKE MY INSURANCE EVEN THOUGH I WANT TO GO TO THEM AND I REALLY WANT TO.

THIS THERAPIST IS BOOKED FOR THE NEXT SEVEN MONTHS.

THEY WON'T BE ABLE TO TAKE ME.

I MEAN, THERE IS THIS, AS YOU KNOW, THIS PROBLEM WITH THE INFRASTRUCTURE NOT MATCHING THE DEMAND FROM PEOPLE.

WHAT DO YOU THINK WE DO ABOUT THAT TO GET MORE PEOPLE INTO THESE CAREERS TO SERVE MORE PEOPLE?

RIGHT NOW, THIS IS A NATIONAL MENTAL HEALTH SHORTAGE.

YES.

IT'S SOMETHING THAT I HAVE NEVER SEEN QUITE AS SEVERE AS BEFORE.

I SHOULD SAY ALSO THAT I DON'T THINK NEW YORK IS AT THE BOTTOM OF THIS LIST.

WE PROBABLY DO A BETTER JOB THAN A LOT OF STATES.

WE DO.

WE DO.

BUT IT'S STILL A VERY SERIOUS SHORTAGE.

YES.

I THINK WE HAVE TO GET YOUNG PEOPLE IN THE FIELD, AND I THINK YOU CAN WE GIN THAT IN HIGH SCHOOL.

WE'VE ALREADY BEEN TALKING TO SOME HIGH SCHOOLS TO LET US COME IN AND SPEAK WITH THEM IN COLLEGES, COMMUNITY COLLEGES.

SO I THINK WE REALLY NEED TO TALK WITH SOCIAL WORKERS WHEN THEY GRADUATE, WHAT DO YOU WANT TO DO?

THERE'S DIFFERENT THINGS YOU CAN DO WITH THE SOCIAL WORK OR NURSES OR PHYSICIANS, WHETHER YOU WANT TO BECOME A PSYCHIATRIST, SO IT'S ENGAGING PEOPLE.

THE SECOND THING IS MAKING IT VIABLE FOR THEM AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THE STAGE IS SUPPORTED IS LOAN REPAYMENTS WHICH IS A PRETTY GOOD INCENTIVE WE HAVE LOAN REPAYMENTS FOR PSYCHIATRISTS, NURSE PRACTITIONERS, AND JUST RECENTLY IN THIS YEAR'S BUDGET, WE HAVE LOAN REPAYMENTS FOR PSYCHOLOGISTS, SOCIAL WORKERS AND LICENSED MENTAL HEALTH COUNSELORS SO THAT'S TERRIFIC.

SO THAT MEANS THOSE INDIVIDUALS CAN ALSO YOU WORK THEN IN THE CLINIC OR YOU WORK IN A PUBLIC SECTOR SETTING OF SOME SORT AND YOU GET YOUR STUDENT LOANS PAID OVER A NUMBER OF YEARS, $10,000 A YEAR FOR SO MANY YEARS.

IT'S REALLY GOOD.

I MEAN, HONESTLY, IF YOU PAID FOR ME TO GO TO SCHOOL, I WOULD GO TO SCHOOL FOR JUST ABOUT ANYTHING.

THAT'S GREAT.

[LAUGHTER] THAT'S ONE WAY TO ENTICE PEOPLE INTO THE FIELD.

SURE.

I THINK WE HAVE TO GET THE WORD OUT ABOUT WHAT A REWARDING PROFIT IS.

YEAH.

I THINK MOST OF US WHO WORK IN THIS FIELD SAY WE GET MORE OUT OF IT THAN WE GIVE PERSONALLY.

WORKING IN HUMAN SERVICES IS VERY REWARDING.

IT CAN BE, YOU KNOW, DIFFICULT AT TIMES BUT IT'S TREMENDOUSLY REWARDING.

I THINK WE HAVE TO GET THE WORD OUT TO HAVE PEOPLE TO WANT TO BE INTERESTED IN THE FIELD.

I THINK SO, TOO.

MENTAL HEALTH IS-- YOU KNOW, IT'S A SPECIFIC FIELD.

IT'S NOT TALKING ABOUT PHYSICAL HEALTH AND IT'S NOT TALKING ABOUT OTHER THINGS.

I SEE MENTAL HEALTH AS SORT OF TARGETED.

WHAT I DON'T SEE NECESSARILY IS KIND OF LIKE A LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL FOR ALL OF THIS.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN.

WHEN I LOOK AT THE INFRASTRUCTURE, I'M THINKING OF THE INCENTIVES THAT YOU BRING IN AND I'M THINKING OF HOW THIS INDUSTRY MOVES FORWARD WITHOUT THAT.

IF WE CAN'T GET GOVERNMENT TO COMMIT, ARE THERE OTHER WAYS, DO YOU THINK?

I THINK GOVERNMENT IS COMMITTING IN A BIG WAY.

FOR EXAMPLE, WE HAVE ACROSS THE STATE JUST THIS ONE EXAMPLE, GOVERNOR HOCHUL PUT A BILLION DOLLARS INTO MENTAL HEALTH.

YES.

A BIG PIECE OF THAT IS HOUSING, BUT A BIG PIECE OF THAT ARE SERVICES SO WE HAVE 13 COMMUNITY BEHAVIORAL HEALTH CENTERS IN NEW YORK STATE.

WE WILL HAVE 39 IN TWO YEARS.

THAT'S A HUGE INVESTMENT IN SERVICES.

NOW IT TAKES TIME FOR THAT TO GET OUT AND IT ALSO WE HAVE TO HAVE THE STAFF FOR THOSE SERVICES.

RIGHT.

BUT GOVERNMENT IN NEW YORK STATE HAS INVESTED A HUGE AMOUNT OF DOLLARS IN EXPANDING MENTAL HEALTH SERVICES IN RECOGNITION FOR JUST WHAT YOU SAID, THAT THE RESOURCES HAVE TO BE THERE AND THAT WE HAVE TO GROW THEM NOW ESPECIALLY SINCE THE NEED HAS GROWN.

SO THERE IS A HUGE GOVERNMENT INVESTMENT.

THE OTHER PIECE, I THINK, IS TO HAVE INSURERS ALSO RECOGNIZE THE INVESTMENT.

BY THAT, I MEAN COMMERCIAL INSURERS.

THAT'S WHAT I WAS GOING TO ASK YOU ABOUT.

I BELIEVE, TRUTHFULLY, THE COMMERCIAL INSURANCE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO PAY AT A RATE THAT IS AT LEAST THE EQUIVALENT OF MEDICAID OR MORE.

OFTEN THEY DO NOT, WHICH IS INTERESTING.

SO I THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT IN TERMS OF THE PUBLIC SECTOR.

SO I THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT COMMERCIAL INSURANCE BE PARTNERS ON MAKING SURE THAT THERE'S ACCESS, REAL ACCESS FOR INDIVIDUALS WITH MENTAL HEALTH, AND THAT MEANS MAKING SURE JUST LIKE YOU HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU CAN GET TO A CARDIOLOGIST IF YOU NEED ONE, YOU SHOULD HAVE NETWORKS AND THE ACCESS POINTS FOR INDIVIDUALS TO GET MEANT AT HEALTH SERVICES AND COMMERCIAL INSURANCE SHOULD BE MORE INVOLVED, I THINK, IN BEING RESPONSIBLE FOR THAT AND MAKING SURE THAT ACCESS IS THERE.

FOR COMMERCIALLY INSURED INDIVIDUALS.

THINK ABOUT HOW WE THINK ABOUT THESE THINGS SO DIFFERENTLY FROM PHYSICAL HEALTH.

IF I HAVE PAIN IN MY CHEST, I'M GOING TO THE EMERGENCY ROOM.

IF I'M FEELING I MAY BE ENTERING A DEPRESSION, IF I'M SOMEBODY WHO HASN'T EXPERIENCED THAT BEFORE, MAYBE I DON'T KNOW THAT I NEED HELP AND THEN IF MY INSURANCE COMPANY SAYS, WELL, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PAY OUT-OF-POCKET $300 TO SEE A THERAPIST, I'M PROBABLY NOT EVEN GOING TO FIND OUT IF I NEED THAT HELP.

I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE STILL-- WE STILL HAVE A STIGMA OUT THERE ABOUT MENTAL HEALTH.

YES.

AND WE SEPARATE IT FROM PHYSICAL HEALTH AND THERE REALLY IS NO DIFFERENCE.

ONE OF THE MAJOR INITIATIVES A NUMBER OF YEARS AGO WAS TO PUSH MENTAL HEALTH EDUCATION IN SCHOOLS.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU REMEMBER THIS.

NEW YORK STATE HAD THE FIRST LAW.

THIS WAS THE MENTAL HEALTH ASSOCIATION WHO DID THIS SO YOU HAD TO HAVE A CURRICULUM FOR MENTAL HEALTH IN SCHOOLS.

SO THE NEXT GENERATIONS THAT GROW UP, HOPEFULLY, WILL NOT HAVE THAT FEAR THAT THEY, YOU KNOW, THEY BREAK THEIR ARM, THEY GO TO THE DOCTOR.

IF YOU FEEL DEPRESSED, YOU GO TO A DOCTOR.

THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE THAT STIGMA ANYMORE.

I THINK YOU BEGIN BY EDUCATING PEOPLE EARLY ON AND EDUCATING PARENTS AND KIDS.

SO HOPEFULLY FUTURE GENERATIONS WILL NOT HAVE THAT RELUCTANCE OR WILL NOT HAVE A LITTLE OF THAT, OH, I SHOULD JUST BE ABLE TO GET OVER THIS.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO FEEL LIKE YOU GOT OVER IT.

IF YOU HAVE A FEVER OF 102, YOU GO SEE SOMEBODY.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO GET YOURSELF OVER IT.

THERE'S HELP OUT THERE.

I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE BIGGEST STUMBLING BLOCKS AND WE NEED TO HAVE THE RESOURCES AND THERE'S A LOT OF RESOURCES AND YOU HAVE TO PARTNER WITH COMMERCIAL INSURERS IN MAKING SURE THOSE RESOURCES ARE THERE.

YES.

STIGMA IS TOP OF THE LIST FOR ME.

I TALK ABOUT MY MENTAL HEALTH ALL THE TIME WITH PEOPLE JUST TO BREAK IT DOWN.

BECAUSE IF I TELL SOMEBODY THAT I STRUGGLE WITH CHRONIC DEPRESSION, THEY'RE GOING TO TELL ME, MAYBE I DO TOO.

THAT JUST MOVES EVERYBODY FORWARD.

WE'LL KEEP AN EYE ON ALL THIS.

DR. ANNE MARIE SULLIVAN, COMMISSIONER OF THE OFFICE OF MENTAL HEALTH, THANK YOU SO MUCH.

THANK YOU.

[ THEME MUSIC ] AND AS THE COMMISSIONER SAID, THERE'S A BIG FOCUS RIGHT NOW ON YOUTH MENTAL HEALTH.

IF YOU'RE A TEACHER OR JUST AN ADULT WHO CARES, WE NOW HAVE A NEW YOUTH MENTAL HEALTH TOOL KIT ONLINE.

IT EXPLAINS HOW MENTAL ILLNESS DEVELOPS AND WHAT YOU CAN DO TO HELP.

WE'LL LINK TO THAT ON OUR WEBSITE.

THAT'S AT NYNOW.ORG AND STAYING NOW WITH MENTAL HEALTH AND THINKING ABOUT THE WORST CASE SCENARIO.

WHEN SOMEONE IS STRUGGLING WITH THEIR MENTAL HEALTH EARLY INTERVENTION IS CRITICAL.

JUST TALKING WITH SOMEONE CAN MAKE A WORLD OF DIFFERENCE, AND THAT IF THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN, A CRISIS CAN LEAD TO THOUGHTS OF SUICIDE OR SELF-HARM.

IF THAT'S THE CASE, DON'T FORGET TO DIAL OR TEXT 988.

BUT ONE DEMOGRAPHIC THAT WE DON'T OFTEN THINK OF WHEN IT COMES TO SUICIDE IS OLDER NEW YORKERS.

SO IN THIS PIECE FROM WMHT'S WILL PEDIGO, WE HEAR FROM ONE EXPERT ON HOW TO MANAGE THAT CRISIS AT ANY AGE.

THE MORE OPEN AND DIRECT WE CAN BE ABOUT SUICIDE, THE MORE CHANCE WE HAVE OF PREVENTING IT AND CONNECTING WITH PEOPLE.

[THEME MUSIC] [ SOMBER MUSIC PLAYS ] GOOD MORNING, EVERYBODY.

I'LL BE PRESENTING TODAY A PROGRAM.

IT'S AN AMERICAN FOUNDATION FOR SUICIDE PREVENTION PROGRAM, AFSP AND IT'S CALLED HELP SAVE LIVES.

SUICIDES ARE PREVENTIBLE.

AND ONE WAY THAT WE DO HELP PREVENT THEM IS THROUGH OPEN AND DIRECT CONVERSATION.

AND OUR GOAL FOR YOU TODAY IS TO LEARN MORE ABOUT SUICIDE PREVENTION AND WHAT WE ALL, WORKING TOGETHER, CAN DO.

WHEN I WALK IN THE ROOM, I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY KNOW THE IMPORTANCE OF MENTAL HEALTH, LET THEM KNOW THAT WE CARE ABOUT THEM AND THAT THEY'RE NOT ALONE.

WHO IS AT RISK?

WE KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS ONE.

EVERYBODY.

THANKS TO THE RESEARCH, THOUGH, WE DO KNOW THAT THERE ARE KEY FACTORS THAT PUT DIFFERENT PEOPLE AT HIGHER RISKS.

SENIORS, AS A MATTER OF FACT, ARE AT THE HIGHEST RISK.

THERE'S NOT ENOUGH ATTENTION PAID TO SENIORS AND SUICIDE.

THE NUMBER ONE FACTOR IN SENIORS AND SUICIDE IS LONELINESS.

IF YOU, YOURSELF, ARE HAVING THOUGHTS OF SUICIDE, REACH OUT.

YOU CAN CALL THAT 988 NUMBER AND GET SUPPORT.

DOES EVERYBODY KNOW WHAT 988 IS?

IT'S THE NEW SUICIDE PREVENTION HOTLINE NUMBER.

SO WHEN THE HOUSE IS ON FIRE, THERE'S A CAR ACCIDENT, WE DIAL 11.

NOW, WE DIAL 988 FOR MENTAL HEALTH.

EMERGENCIES OR CRISIS, OR JUST IF YOU WANT TO TALK TO SOMEBODY.

SUICIDE PREVENTION IS REALLY GRASS ROOTS.

IT'S JUST-- IT'S US PAYING ATTENTION TO EACH OTHER AND MAKING THE EFFORT TO REACH OUT TO SOMEBODY AND NOT ASSUMING THAT SOMEONE ELSE IS GOING TO DO IT [ THEME MUSIC ] THAT WAS LYNN KEYES FROM THE CAPITAL REGION CHAPTER OF THE AMERICAN FOUNDATION FOR SUICIDE PREVENTION, AND THAT'S WHERE OUR NEXT GUEST IS FROM AS WELL.

WHEN DAN EGAN LOST HIS FATHER TO SUE SIGHT MORE THAN THREE DECADES AGO, IT CHANGED HIS LIFE COMPLETELY.

AT FIRST, HE DIDN'T TALK ABOUT IT AND PRETENDED THAT EVERYTHING WAS ALL RIGHT.

BUT I WASN'T AND HE KNEW IT WASN'T.

FAST FORWARD TO TODAY AND DAN LEADS THE CAPITAL REGION CHAPTER OF THE AFSP AND SITS ON THE NATIONAL LOSS AND HEALING COUNCIL.

WE SPOKE ABOUT MENTAL HEALTH TODAY AND HOW MORE LIVES CAN BE SAVED.

[ THEME MUSIC ] DAN, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

WE APPRECIATE IT.

OH, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME, DAN.

OF COURSE.

SO MENTAL HEALTH, I FEEL LIKE, IS SUCH A PIVOTAL ISSUE RIGHT NOW.

I MEAN, THERE'S JUST SO MUCH COMING OUT OF THE PANDEMIC, DIFFERENT TRAUMAS HAPPENING, POLITICS, A LOT ON THE BOARD.

HOW OFTEN DO YOU HEAR ABOUT THAT IN YOUR WORK?

YOU HAVE TO HEAR ABOUT IT ALL THE TIME ABSOLUTELY.

IN SOME WAYS, IT'S KIND OF THE ONE SILVER LINING OUT OF PANDEMIC IS FOR A LOT OF FOLKS IT WAS THE FIRST TIME THEY REALLY EXPERIENCED SOME OF THAT ANXIETY AND THAT ISOLATION AND WHILE WE DON'T WISH THAT ON ANYBODY, IT HELPED TO RAISE AWARENESS AND YOU KNOW, LIKE YOU SAID, WITH THE DIVISIVENESS IN THE COUNTRY OVER POLITICS, YOU KNOW, MENTAL HEALTH AND SUICIDE PREVENTION IS REALLY THE TOPIC THAT I THINK SHOULD HELP UNITE US AND WE CAN ALL AGREE THAT WE NEED TO DO BETTER.

I THINK SO, TOO, I MEAN, DURING THE PANDEMIC, I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT.

IT'S A TIME WHERE A LOT OF PEOPLE SOUGHT HELP BECAUSE THE PRESSURES WERE JUST SO INTENSE.

I MEAN, YOU HAD SO MANY PEOPLE OUT OF WORK, KIND OF HOPELESS ABOUT THEIR FUTURE, THEY DIDN'T KNOW WHAT TO DO.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT REALLY COMES DOWN TO THIS WHEN WE TALK ABOUT MENTAL HEALTH IS THE STIGMA OF IT.

A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T GET HELP BECAUSE THEY'RE AFRAID TO TALK ABOUT IT.

WHAT DO WE DO ABOUT THAT?

YEAH.

AND EVERY TIME WE TALK ABOUT IT OURSELVES, RIGHT, LIKE I DEALT WITH MY OWN MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES AS WELL AS HAVING THE SUICIDE LAWS AND EVERY TIME YOU SHARE YOUR STORY, IT KIND OF GIVES PEOPLE PERMISSION TO THEIR THEIRS.

YEAH.

IF WE WANT FOLKS REALLY, LIKE WE SAY, TAKE OUR MENTAL HEALTH AS IMPORTANT AS WE DO OUR PHYSICAL HELL, IT REAM REALLY COME DOWN TO BEING WILLING TO HAVE THOSE OPEN CONVERSATIONS AND THOSE OF US WHO ARE OUTSPOKEN ABOUT IT HOPEFULLY WILL HELP OTHERS BE ABLE TO DO SO AS WELL.

YEAH.

I ASK ABOUT STIGMA BECAUSE I THINK THE FIRST STEP FOR ANYBODY IN TERMS OF DEALING WITH THOUGHTS OF SUICIDE OR SELF-HARM IS REALLY JUST TALKING TO SOMEBODY.

I MEAN, GUIDE ME THROUGH IT.

IF I'M SOMEBODY WHO IS HAVING THESE THOUGHTS OF, IT'S A VERY CRUCIAL TIME TO MAKE A DECISION.

WHAT SHOULD I DO?

IF YOU'RE TRULY IN THAT CRISIS, WHICH SOMETIMES WE KNOW CAN BE SHORT, YOU KNOW, FIRST STEP, DIAL 988 OR TEXT IT IF YOU DON'T WANT TO TALK TO SOMEONE.

YOU KNOW, SINCE IT'S BEEN SHORTENED AND WE'RE A LITTLE OVER THE FIRST YEAR OF IMPLEMENTATION AND WE HAVE SEEN THAT THE CALLS TO THE LINE HAVE GONE UP 40%, BUT THE AMAZING PART IS THE TEXT LINE.

THE TEXT TO 988 HAVE GONE UP A THOUSAND PERCENT.

IT SHOWS PEOPLE ARE USING IT, YOU KNOW, NO MATTER WHERE YOU ARE AND WHEN IT IS, THERE'S ALWAYS SOMEONE THERE YOU CAN SUPPORT.

FOR SOME PEOPLE THAT CRISIS MIGHT BE OVER AND IT WILL PASS, BUT FOR MOST OF US, WE'RE GONNA NEED ADDITIONAL HELP IN ALWAYS SPEAKING TO A MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL.

NOW THAT'S WHERE IN SOME PLACES RIGHT NOW, WE REALLY RUN INTO STRUGGLES BECAUSE THERE JUST AREN'T ENOUGH PROVIDERS FOR THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO NEED HELP.

THAT'S WHAT I WANTED TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT.

I'M SOMEBODY WHO SUFFERS FROM CHRONIC DEPRESSION.

IN FINDING A THERAPIST, IT'S IMPOSSIBLE A LOT OF THE TIME.

I MEAN, BECAUSE OF AVAILABILITY, THEIR AVAILABILITY IN TERMS OF THEIR TIME.

THEY'RE WORKING 9:00 TO 5:00.

I'M ALSO WORKING 9:00 TO 5:00.

I CAN'T JUST GO IN THE MIDDLE OF THE DAY A LOT OF THE TIME.

THAT STRIKES TO AN ISSUE THAT I THINK IS MUCH BIGGER THAN ME AND MY PROBLEMS.

THE MENTAL HEALTH INFRASTRUCTURE IN THIS STATE I DON'T FEEL MEETS THE DEMAND THAT WE HAVE.

I'M WONDERING HOW YOU FEEL ABOUT THAT AND WHAT WE CAN DO ABOUT IT.

YEAH.

I THINK WHAT YOU SAY IS COMPLETELY TRUE.

OUR STATE, AND THIS IS A LITTLE SCARY AT TIMES MIGHT BE ONE OF BETTER STATES IN TERMS OF MENTAL HEALTH INFRASTRUCTURE.

SO THERE'S A LOT OF WORK TO BE DONE ACROSS THE BOARD.

WE REALLY NEED TO FIND THOSE WAYS FOR THE PRIVATE SECTOR AS WELL TO INCENTIVIZE FOLKS INTO GOING INTO THAT PROFESSION.

YOU KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, WE HAVE A VERY LIMITED NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE DIVERSE BACKGROUNDS WHO ARE-- SO IF YOU WANTED TO SEE SOMEONE WHO LOOKED LIKE YOU, SHARED A GENDER IDENTITY, YOU KNOW, SHARED A RELIGIOUS FAITH, IT WOULD BE AN AMAZING STRUGGLE.

THAT'S ONE STEP AND THEN INVESTING IN IT.

THE GOVERNOR INVESTED A BILLION DOLLARS IN IT THIS BUDGET SEASON WHICH IS GREAT.

BUT THEN IT COMES DOWN TO HOW THAT MONEY IS SPENT, AND THAT'S REALLY JUST THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG, RIGHT?

YEAH.

MENTAL HEALTH IS ALMOST CONSTANTLY WE'RE IN TRIAGE MODE.

SO WE REALLY ARE DEALING WITH CRISIS ALL THE TIME.

WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT WHAT'S THE BEST WAY TO PREVENT SUICIDE, RIGHT NOW MOST PEOPLE WOULD SAY 988.

WELL, THAT'S THE EQUIVALENT OF CATCHING SOMEONE IN STAGE FOUR CANCER.

YES.

SO THE GOAL IS TO REALLY MOVE IT BACK TO WHERE WE GET TO SEE FOLKS SEE A MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL WHEN YOU'RE HEALTHY SO YOU CAN BUILD UP THOSE SKILLS TO DEAL WITH THE CRISIS WHEN IT COMES TO IT SO IT DOESN'T REACH A CRITICAL STAGE.

EXACTLY.

KIND OF LIKE HOW I SEE MY DOCTOR FOR, YOU KNOW, PHYSICAL EVERY YEAR WHEN HE WANTS TO CHECK ME OUT.

I THINK A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN THAT REGULAR IF I WAS GOING TO SEE A THERAPIST WHILE I AM MENTALLY HEALTHY, I WOULDN'T GO JUST ONCE A YEAR.

EVEN STILL WHEN WE TALK ABOUT OUR PREVENTATIVE MEDICINE THAT PHYSICAL IS COVERED 100% BY INSURANCE.

RIGHT.

A LOT OF THE PREVENTATIVE TESTS TO SCREEN FOR CANCER ARE COVERED 100%.

WE DON'T HAVE THAT AS WIDELY AVAILABLE FOR MENTAL HEALTH.

MAYBE IT COMES DOWN-- AND AGAIN THIS IS ME AS AN ADVOCATE, NOT ME AS A PROFESSIONAL, BUT DEVELOPING THAT MENTAL HEALTH PHYSICAL.

RIGHT NOW, THE DOCTOR DOES HAVE THAT SHEET THEY'LL GIVE YOU SOMETIMES.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOURS DOES WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT ONE TO FIVE AND THAT'S ALWAYS HARD, BUT AGAIN, ARE THEY READY TO HEAR THAT ANSWER?

RIGHT.

AGAIN, IT'S MAKING SURE THAT OUR PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIANS ARE TRAINED IN HOW TO DEAL WITH SOMEONE WHO MIGHT BE IN CRISIS, YOU KNOW, AND THEN INCENTIVIZING PEOPLE TO GO INTO THIS PSYCHOLOGY OF THE SOCIAL WORK FIELD ESPECIALLY COMMUNITIES OF COLOR THAT ARE UNDERSERVED AND MARGINALIZED COMMUNITIES TO MAKE SURE THERE'S REPRESENTATION.

YOU KNOW, THE OTHER THING THAT'S A HUGE THING IS YOUTH.

THERE AREN'T THAT MANY STATE-RUN YOUTH BEDS.

I HAVE HEARD IT FROM SOMEONE AND IT'S LIKE DOWN STATE, OUT TO UTICA.

IN THIS AREA IF YOU HAD A CHILD WHO NEEDED IN-PATIENT, IT'S NOT AVAILABLE THROUGH THE STATE AND IT'S VERY LIMITEDLY AVAILABLE THROUGH PRIVATE.

THAT'S REALLY JUST A FUNDING ISSUE, I'M ASSUMING.

MORE FUNDING WOULD LEAD TO MORE BEDS.

EXACTLY.

IT'S MORE FUNDING.

OBVIOUSLY, THERE WOULD BE CONSTRUCTION AND BUILDOUT AND IMPLEMENTATION AND FINDING PROVIDERS.

ULTIMATELY, A LOT OF IT DOES COME DOWN TO FUNDING AND RAISING MONEY TO FUND MORE MENTAL HEALTH PROJECTS AND TO DO BETTER RESEARCH, SO WE TRULY UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, THE ROOT CAUSE BEHIND DEPRESSION/ANXIETY AND WHAT LEADS SOMEONE TO BE SUICIDAL.

DAN EGAN, BOARD CHAIR OF THE CAPITAL REGION CHAPTER OF THE AMERICAN FOUNDATION FOR SUICIDE PREVENTION.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR CHATTING ABOUT ALL THIS.

I KNOW IT'S NOT ALWAYS EASY SO THANK YOU.

YEAH.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME.

I APPRECIATE IT MORE THAN YOU CAN IMAGINE.

[ THEME MUSIC ] IF YOU RECENTLY LOST SOMEONE TO SUICIDE, THE AFSP HAS RESOURCES TO HELP YOU PROCESS THAT LOSS AS YOUR LIFE CONTINUES.

THEY ALSO PRETTY REGULARLY HOST WALKS AND EVENTS TO RAISE AWARENESS AND FUNDING.

WE'LL LINK TO THEIR WEBSITE ALONG WITH THIS WEEK'S SHOW ON OUR WEBSITE.

AS ALWAYS, THAT'S AT NYNOW.ORG.

BUT THE KEY, EXPERTS SAY, IS TO ASK FOR HELP WHEN YOU NEED IT, WHETHER THAT'S THROUGH 988, A TRUSTED LOVED ONE OR A MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL.

THERE IS HELP OUT THERE.

AND WE WILL ALWAYS BE HERE.

WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

THANKS FOR WATCHING THIS WEEK'S "NEW YORK NOW."

HAVE A GREAT WEEK AND BE WELL.

[ THEME MUSIC ] ANNOUNCER: FUNDING FOR "NEW YORK NOW" IS PROVIDED BY WNET AND BY THE NEW YORK STATE EDUCATION DEPARTMENT.