From WXXI news.

This is connections.

I'm Evan Dawson.

Our connection this hour was made at the Seneca meadows.

Always one of the great marketing names in local history.

Kind of sounds like a golf course or a retirement community.

The Seneca meadows.

Well, it is not.

Seneca meadows is the name of the largest landfill in New York state.

Located in Seneca Falls, the landfill can receive up to 12,000 pounds of new trash each day, most of it coming from downstate by truck.

It employs 160 people full time.

The landfill itself is 400 acres, but the landfill is approaching its license capacity and the owner would like to expand it another 15 years if taken in trash there.

In return, they're offering millions of dollars to the local government, extending the current agreement that town leaders say keeps taxes down.

But a growing movement has formed to oppose the expansion of this landfill.

From school teachers to business owners.

To many parents of young children who've had told us they've had to keep their kids inside on beautiful summer days because of the smell or the vapors.

They're worried about the effect, the effect on their family's health.

New York State Assembly member Anna Kellis told us a year ago that the state should deny the company's request to expand.

Ultimately, this will be up to Governor Hochul and the state Department of Environmental Conservation.

But the state might have been watching for a sign earlier this month from the local government, and the Seneca Falls Town Board voted to approve the expansion of this landfill.

The board meets again tomorrow night and there will be a local demonstration.

And this hour, we want to understand the perspectives involved here.

Let me welcome first Yvonne Taylor, who is co-founder and vice president of the Seneca Lake Guardian.

Welcome back to the program.

Thanks for having me, Evan.

Mark Pettifer is with us, a special project manager for Waterloo Container.

Mark, welcome.

Thanks for being with us.

Thank you.

Great to be here.

Michelle Gillan is with us, who is a local parent and has a lot to say from that parent perspective.

Michele, welcome.

Thanks for making time for us.

Thank you Evan, I appreciate it.

We're going to start this program with the short conversation I had this morning with the town supervisor from Seneca Falls.

That's Frank Schmidt.

Her the supervisor was not able to join us live on the program, but was generous enough with his time to record that interview with me this morning.

And for a little perspective here.

The Seneca Falls Town Board had two separate votes about a month ago, and the town supervisor is one of the voting members of the board.

So there's five voting members.

The supervisors, one of them.

And the votes went for one and three.

Two.

The supervisor was the one who was, changed his vote.

So.

And it's not a change of a vote.

I'll explain here.

The first is, an agreement that essentially, honors the company that wants to run this landfills desire to run the landfill.

The second is the kind of the expansion agreement.

And the supervisor is going to explain in this interview why he was yes on one and no on the other, but also his perspective on who is going to make this final decision.

So let's listen to my conversation from just a couple of hours ago with the supervisor of the Seneca Falls, Frank Schmidt.

Her.

You're welcome.

Thank you for having me.

Well, let me start with this question.

a year ago, when we were first hearing about, you know, the possible end of capacity or reaching capacity of this landfill, and then this idea that the company wanted to go another 15 years to 2040. yeah.

I know there's been a lot of debate.

Do you think it is inevitable that this is going to happen, that the state's going to approve it?

And the people need to sort of understand that this is coming one way or another?

That's impossible for me to answer because the state I have no idea what they will do.

I, I think the misunderstanding is people think we have control, but it's really totally up to the state gives them a permit.

They will be operating.

Okay.

And so then on those grounds, take me through the vote that got all that attention four weeks ago.

The vote in which there's A41 vote, there's A32 vote.

and take me through because you're a voting member of the board.

Take me through what those votes mean and why you voted the way you did.

Okay, so the first a vote was on the horse community agreement.

Okay.

The four of us voted for that.

I think that's very important for the town to have in place.

It's basically like an insurance policy.

If we do not have the horse community agreement signed, they basically do not have to pay us.

They'd go back to the old structure from the earlier permit with this new host agreement, if the state gives them the permit.

And that's once I emphasize only if the state gives them the permit, then host community agreement kicks in.

At that point, we'll be getting paid a significant more amount of money.

And we're it's an insurance policy.

If they get the permit, we get paid.

If they don't get the permit and they're forced to close that, we don't get anything.

Okay.

Sorry.

Yeah.

I'm sorry.

Take me through the second vote, then.

Okay.

So as far as the permit goes, that's basically saying do we want to do we want the landfill to be permitted to operate in the town of Santa Clause?

so three of us, three of them voted for it and two of us voted against it.

my thought why I voted against it is I feel I need to protect the people of this town.

I want to emphasize, I do believe the landfill does a very nice job, Kyle and his crew to give up a good effort to keep it as safe as possibly can.

I just feel a landfills should not be located so close to schools.

You know, we need to protect our children.

If this becomes a factor with the children, it should be.

Our job is as their responsibility to protect them from any health hazards that could be there.

What?

I feel a landfill should be put out somewhere rural where there's no schools, no housing, no community within 25 miles.

There is spots like that in New York State, and that's what the state needs to do.

That's my vote and why I voted no for the permit.

Okay, so your position.

Tell me if I'm standing this correctly is the first vote.

You want to make sure that if the state greenlights this, the town still benefits and gets revenue here.

The second vote is if it's up to you, you would not vote to expand it.

You want to see this capped where it is?

Correct.

I would like to see it put more in the rural area.

We do dispose of our trash and people need to stop making all the trash we make.

You know we can cut back by recycle and and composting and stuff.

And we've set up good programs in Seneca Falls to do that.

But in general, it could be located as much rural place, make it safer for the citizens of the state, actually.

Now, some of the people who oppose this project's expansion have said that the town votes both of the votes, not just the second vote.

Both of the votes are an indication to the state of where the town stands.

So when you vote for the host agreement, it's the town's way of saying to the state, go for it.

Go ahead.

Like we're we're on board in some way.

Do you disagree with that?

I think I do.

I think the state is doing the way they handle it.

They're looking into, you know, the public should have a chance to commit to the state once all the paperwork is filed by the landfill to for this permit.

So I think during that time is when the people need to speak to the state.

They need to reach out to their, you know, legislators and, and, and talk to them about it.

It's it I don't think this town board really has any say whether or not they left us open or closed.

Okay.

And when it comes to the vote of the board on the operating permit, you disagreed with the majority.

What is your understanding after talking to your colleagues on the board who voted for it?

What is your understanding about why they did vote to greenlight this?

Well, I don't want to speak for them.

I think they're they're and then they think it's okay.

That would be my take on it.

I mean, we didn't really have a meeting afterwards.

We all voted.

You know, we all had of time.

They all were given the opportunity at the meeting to say why they voted for it.

But I know one the one person that voted for it in his there he is kind of correct.

He said if we have a permit, at least we can hold them accountable for the things, you know, the order and stuff like that.

With no permit in place.

They're not violating anything.

So with the rules on the permit, then we have some enforcement power.

It was his taking about it.

So in that regard, you just correct.

Okay.

But what's an example of how you hold the landfill to account when there are odor problems, when there's when it's difficult for kids to even play outside?

What can you do?

Well, I mean, working with the landfill there, once the door is detected, they're supposed to take action.

And this is all the new host community agreement, where they will try to cover up more of the hill.

They will do whatever they can to get the order to stop.

They have to cap something or cover more ground or slow down.

How many trucks are coming in?

you know, dump it at that time.

So there there is stuff that they need to take action of once an order is detected.

And I feel like, they are going to try to do their best.

I mean, they're trying to serve the community.

Well, I just it's a landfill and it's going to have smell.

And that's why it needs to be located in a more rural area.

My opinion.

All right, Mr.

Supervisor, finally, the last subject I just want to make sure I get your perspective on is is money.

I've got a number of emails from people who live in the area who have been saying that this is all about money.

Follow the money.

And they they make two points.

The first is that this idea that we're going to expand the landfill capacity to 2040, and because of the way this agreement sets up, that's millions of tens of millions of dollars for Seneca Falls.

And that's very attractive to the town.

It makes operating the town easier.

so that's one thing.

But the other point that people are or at least alleging, I guess I would say is, is wondering how much money is actually flowing or are campaigns being funded?

How how invested is this company in what's happening with this decision?

So can you address both those points?

I mean, the whole street agreement is a lot of money.

and I, I feel that we're protected if the state gives them the permit, because if the state gives them the permit, they're going to be operating.

We have to give them a town permit for.

Well, we're going on like 14 months now or 16 months, and they're still operating.

So our permit is not going to stop them either way.

So if the state gives it to them, we're protected with all this movement.

It is a lot of money, but it's I still feel I would rather protect the children my own vote than worry about the money part.

Can the town function without that money?

Absolutely.

Would we have to make some cuts?

Absolutely.

But it could be done.

We already.

But myself and my, town manager have worked on some numbers.

Because if it does, cause it could be, you know, at the end of this year.

So we worked out numbers and, basically right now, if we didn't cut anything, the average $200,000 house, the town tax would go $500 approximately.

Okay.

What cuts we I truly believe we could almost bring the budget.

There would be no increase without that money.

Okay, well, what about the second part?

People are wondering, is this company investing in political leadership in other ways?

What do you know about that?

Well, I think we see it every year when, you know, every two years when there's an election, you know, they few people in this town get tons of fliers mailed to them.

And when it says, you know who they come from, I think it's no surprise that, yes, they are involved in the elections with this town.

I'm hoping they step away from that and still do that.

But, I, you know, we can't control what people want to spend their money on and everything.

As far as you know, all of their spending has been legal and above board.

Yeah, that I know of.

Yes.

No, I've done no investigation into it.

it's not my place.

Okay.

Lastly, and I'll let you go.

And I really appreciate your time, Mr. supervisor, how is the quality of how is the quality of life there?

And does it suffer because of this landfill on a nearly near daily basis?

In your mind?

Do I think we probably lost some businesses because of the landfill being here?

You know, that whole corridor no one's going to develop there?

I do have, you know, obviously the quality of life can be, you know, like, if you're going to plan a picnic or wedding or something, your yard, you might not have to worry about rain that day, but you might have to worry about odors.

So it does affect the people in it.

The worst part of it has got this town totally divided means people that are foreign, people that are against it, and it's it makes it tough.

Just the, you know, it's sad to see people that, you know, not getting along because of an issue like this.

I would like to see everybody in this town, you know, we have to accept what happens if the state gives them the permit.

Then, you know, let's all work together to do our best to, you know, or the town and keep things moving in the right direction.

Sure, I understand that.

But you don't think the town is, like evenly 5050 on this issue, do you?

Know, my guess it's probably 25% against it.

Maybe 20% for it because and the people that are for it, honestly, that's they're worried about their taxes going up because of all the propaganda that's out there.

I honestly think 50% of the town doesn't have an opinion one way or another, really just goes about their daily life and doesn't worry about it.

You know, I don't think it's, you know, 90% against it like that because I would say probably no person would really want a landfill unless, you know, the money part is there.

You know, I mean, there's no other benefit for the town other than the financial.

I mean, but most people you talk about it really don't have an opinion on it one way or another.

That's the Seneca Falls town supervisor, Frank Miller, who recorded that interview with me just this morning.

And I'm grateful for his time.

We're talking about the proposal to expand the largest landfill in New York state, which is not downstate, not near New York City, not on Long Island.

It's in the Finger Lakes.

Seneca meadows is what it's called.

It's got a nice sounding name, but it's 400 acres of landfill, and the owners want to expand its intake for another 15 years.

Right now, it can bring in 6000 tons of new trash every day, most of it from downstate Seneca Falls.

Town board, you just heard, has, in their own way, greenlit this.

But the state is going to decide.

So Governor Hochul could intervene.

State D-e-c has something to say.

And you just heard the conversation with the town supervisor about his position.

Let me bring back our guests who are joining us on the line this hour.

And let me start with Yvonne Taylor, who's co-founder and vice president of the Seneca Lake Guardian.

What stands out to you from that conversation?

First and foremost, thanks for asking, Evan.

first of all, I want it to be clear that our legal team sent to Seneca Falls Town Board in September of last year and again last week, a letter outlining their responsibility in this entire process with the landfill, we explained to them that the state does indeed give the town deference on whether or not they want the landfill to continue, and that there is case law supporting their ability to say no.

So they've received this letter not once, but twice.

And to have Supervisor Schmidt get on and say, it's really not up to the town is either willful ignorance of the law or a willful disregard of those laws, and it's an embarrassment to everyone in this region who is depending on the town to make the right decision moving forward for our future.

Let me follow up on that point here.

So the supervisor is basically saying, look, the state is the ultimate arbiter of this.

They're not he doesn't think that they're looking to the town.

I asked him directly, do you think that they're going to take what the town board did a month ago and say, okay, that's the de facto thumbs up.

Let's go ahead and greenlight this?

And he says he doesn't think so that they will decide independently.

And all Seneca Falls was doing, in his view, at least the way he voted all Seneca Falls was doing was making sure that if the state greenlights it, that they still get the money, that they can keep taxes low, that they get a financial benefit of this landfill continuing to grow.

So he was working in a pragmatic sense there.

What do you think?

what I think is they are failing to understand the state environmental quality review process that they should be well aware of, because on their own website from 2007 is a power point which states that the town is not legally allowed to enter into a host community agreement with the landfill unless and until permits from the state have been issued.

So there's some question there as to whether they understand their laws.

and there is some, some real concern that they think that they don't have any say in this process.

It's it's clearly laid out in the state.

Environmental quality review process, where they say quite frankly, they give a lot of deference to the town, to the town to go ahead and approve of both of these, items.

The local operating permit and the host community agreement gives the Department of Environmental Conservation the false misunderstanding that the town and the people who are represented in the town are in favor of this landfills expansion.

Well, you went wrong.

You also heard him say even that, he only thinks roughly 25% of the people of Seneca Falls are fully opposed to this landfill.

His estimate was 25% of the people of the town are opposed to landfill.

Maybe 20% support it.

Most on the idea that they like the benefit to their tax bill.

And then the rest of the people, you know don't really care one way or the other.

What do you think?

Again, that's outrageous.

They have had public hearings.

They have had public participation in their comprehensive plan.

And again and again, without fail, the overwhelming vocal majority is saying, shut the landfill down.

It's harming our community.

They received over 1200 emails before this vote from people requesting that they do not accept the local operating permit or the host community agreement.

That was, they had hundreds of people show up at a public hearing and speak out against them voting on these two issues.

And so for him to say, oh, gee, I don't know, you know, it seems like really it's a little I don't know, that's I'm sorry, I'm not going to turn on the radio, but it is not an accurate representation of what's going on in his town.

Let me ask Mark and Michelle for their thoughts first of all.

And then we're going to get a little bit more specific.

Got some of the things that the supervisor said.

Mark Pettifer, a special project manager for Waterloo Container.

Mark, remind listeners how far away Waterloo Container is from this landfill.

about, 100 yards or so.

It's, right across the street, unfortunately.

Okay.

And, what stands out to you from the conversation you just heard with the supervisor?

Well, a lot, you know, in some ways, I'd like to thank Supervisor Schmidt for for what he said about wanting to protect the residents.

And and we happen to agree with him that, you know, there is no place for this landfill in Seneca Falls.

I mean, I'd like to remind you and to the listeners, Seneca Falls is the birthplace of women's rights, the home of the Women's Rights National Historic Park.

The inspiration for the movie It's a Wonderful Life.

And right down the road from the birthplace of Memorial Day, the landfill and what it's done to this community.

Like the supervisors, said, from a divisive standpoint, it is the antithesis of what it means to be a native to Seneca Falls and what we stand for.

We also have the Cayuga Nation here.

This is the antithesis of how they view land.

and really, Evan, and I appreciate you giving us the time to talk about this, because for us, it's disruptive to business.

what the town can do.

town code section 300 dash 26 b states that odor.

No use within any district shall emit an odor that is unreasonably offensive, as measured at the property line of use.

So I'll just give you one clear example.

And it's it's very sad and it's embarrassing.

And we have host dignitaries, quite frequently the owner of our company, this is a family owned company.

We're now in our 45th year.

Can you imagine having a United States congressperson coming in and having a smell that they're not familiar with?

So when they get hit with it, they get nervous right off the bat.

And we have to just explain, sorry, it's just the landfill across the street.

But the worst thing is we have employees that have become ill. And on the bad odor days, we have employees that have to be sent home.

And, one of our employees who wishes to remain named, nameless, he was eight miles away entire.

And he wrote a letter to the board last month that said when even when he goes home from work after smelling landfill odor all day, he's forced to open, close the windows and run air filtration units.

He had to buy special filtration units all the way eight miles away.

Entire, which is an added financial burden because the odor is all the way entire New York.

So as far as beyond the property line is it's ridiculous.

It's constantly behind the property line of use.

But but a lot has been discussed here.

It is true that businesses have turned away from this corridor.

We've even had trouble attracting and retaining people to come here.

We don't, we no longer have company picnics on site.

We no longer use our our picnic tables that are outside.

And quite frankly, I mean, there are a lot of health risks, both known and unknown.

And I think that's that's one of the most, scary things for our organization.

Hearing.

Mark Pettifer, who's the special project manager for Waterloo Container Business, right next door to this landfill.

And Mark's right, the supervisor of Seneca Falls, Frank Miller, did say he thinks this the presence and the expansion of this landfill shuts down any hope in that quarter corridor for bringing new business.

That's one of the costs of the landfill.

Michelle Gillan, a local parent.

Do you want to describe what it's like raising kids and how far away are you from the landfill?

I think seven.

Yes.

So every single day, is a concern.

We wake up and the first thing I do like 5 a.m. as I look out to see which way my flag is flying, because I want to know if Waterloo's going to get hit with it, or son of Seneca Falls is going to get hit with it for the day.

And I live in Waterloo.

And so when I see that the wind is blowing east, I'm as happy as can be because unfortunately, I think the landfill is also splitting the town.

Seneca Falls gets all of the money.

they are the ones that benefit from this.

Waterloo gets nothing except our schools are affected daily.

Our homes are affected daily.

Our quality of care.

Children are getting sick.

and there's nothing that we benefit from at all.

And for some reason, you know, only Seneca Falls.

They get to vote on this.

they get the benefit.

Even no businesses to the right and left, the north and south, of of technical meadows there.

If you look at their address, they all say Waterloo, New York, but, and essentially the dump is in Waterloo.

but, you know, because of an agreement, I don't know how many years ago, Seneca Falls gets to basically call the shots.

and it's really unfortunate.

I live about five miles away.

I smell it all the time.

I have to keep my kids inside when it smells, because I've done so much research over the years, and I know just how detrimental it is to them.

I am a parent that picks up my kids when it smells, you know, at school, if it smells on the athletic fields, that's something I'm really concerned about in the playgrounds that my kids are, you know, that are less than one mile from the dump.

It's obviously concerning on a daily basis.

And those days that I'll put my kids in the car, and I, we get in the car and we drive the opposite direction because I want them to be able to, you know, play outside and not have to endure all the chemicals in their lungs.

I have to say to Michelle's point, the first time that I hosted a program on the Seneca meadows landfill, the largest in the state, when I looked it up on the map, I remember thinking, wait, is it Waterloo?

It actually, it's real close to Waterloo.

and it is pretty wild for it to be that close to Waterloo.

It it's kind of split between Seneca Falls and Waterloo, but technically, yes, Seneca Falls gets the benefit of this.

And so, so Michelle's right on that point.

And you heard the supervisor of Seneca Falls earlier this hour.

Frank Schmidt, tell us that if we didn't see the expansion of this landfill, it could lead to an increase of about $500 per $200,000 home in Seneca Falls in new taxes.

So that's the benefit.

It is significant.

It's millions of dollars a year.

And he thinks that's one of the reasons that some people, especially on the town board, continue to greenlight the expansion of this landfill that is supposed to be capped this year.

This is supposed to be it.

But now the company that owns it wants a new 15 year expansion, and they may very well get it.

So, what I want to do is after we take our only break of the hour, I want to address a couple of the things that the supervisor said and make sure that our listeners do understand what is going on.

It's the largest landfill in the state, but wherever you live, there may be a landfill near you that caused you to ask questions about who owns this thing.

You know, who gets to control if it keeps growing, where does our trash go?

Otherwise, why does it come here on trucks from downstate?

who greenlights it?

Who's in control?

So we're trying to talk about all of that.

in advance of another town board meeting for Seneca Falls tomorrow night.

Seneca Lake Guardian has been organizing against this project, but I do want to understand all the people voting for it.

and members of the Seneca Falls Town Board who voted for this project.

You continue to be invited.

We would love to have you on this program in the future.

If you want to.

Come on.

I'm grateful that the supervisor, Frank Schmidt, who is a voting board member, did come on in a taped recorded conversation this morning.

we're also joined by Yvonne Taylor, Mark Pettifer, Michelle Grillo and telling their stories.

And we'll come right back.

We'll take some of your feedback as well.

On our second half hour.

I'm Evan Dawson Tuesday and the next connections.

There are a growing number of cases of students, of people being detained by the federal government after they advocated against Israel or against federal policies.

We'll talk about the implications in our first hour.

Then in our second hour, a conversation about the latest in Parkinson's research.

Talk with you Tuesday.

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This is connections.

I'm Evan Dawson, I'm Yvonne Taylor from Seneca Lake Guardian.

I want to ask you about some of what the supervisor of Seneca Falls said on this program earlier this hour.

Supervisor Schmidt said that when the odor gets to a certain point, or when it becomes when it sort of breaches the facility there, that there, in his words, there are actions that can be taken to hold the landfill owners accountable.

Do you find that to be true or not?

In my experience, no.

the sad reality is that people in the surrounding area have what we call complaint fatigue, because there's a hotline they're supposed to call when they detect odor.

They make a call, a landfill operator shows up, who's been at the landfill all day, comes out, sniffs the air sometimes, doesn't even get out of their vehicle, and then they'll say, no, I don't smell anything.

Or it must be something else.

It's not the landfill.

And so there there are no real repercussions.

Yeah.

yeah.

For, for for making a report, for filing a complaint.

and it's it's it's exhausting for people living there.

A lot of them are just like, well, what's the point of even trying now?

There are no repercussions for calling in an odor complaint.

Okay.

Mark Pettit for you work right across the street.

Do you find that to be the case?

I find that that happens, and it's unfortunate, but I think, most importantly, if the D-e-c is listening to this call, they they know that people smell odor.

They know that we have odor.

And as a matter of fact, it's a great segue, because once we found out that the, National Cancer Institute did a study that found that lung cancer cases in Seneca County from 2016 to 2020 were 30% higher than the state average and 34% higher than the national average.

On top of the fact that the odor, reporting from the landfill kept saying that no odor was detected at our complaint site, which is across the street.

our company president and founder decided to invest tens of thousands of dollars in state of the art, H2, monitoring equipment or hydrogen sulfide is usually associated with odor.

And I'm going to quote the World Health Organization.

They say that hydrogen sulfide concentrations should not exceed five parts per billion, however, to avoid substantial complaints about odor.

For context, at Waterloo Container, our device detected H2 us at or over five parts per billion 139 different times over the last six months, which is 75% of all workdays during that period of time.

So we've proven there is an odor problem.

And in our opinion, it's an odor issue that they cannot control.

Even.

Have you thought about moving, Mark?

Have you thought about moving operations or moving your family or moving yourself?

when you when the company was founded, and when this building was built, you really couldn't see the landfill.

Okay.

It was really just like a field, sort of like viewing it as your backyard.

Well, our backyard full now.

Okay.

No one ever could have conceived.

Every time there was an end date, it got expanded and expanded and expanded at the cost of business owners like Bill.

Lots that have invested millions, tens of millions in this community, providing good paying, quality jobs for people in this county in the surrounding region.

I mean, what would you do?

What would you do?

You can't just pack up and leave.

But the frustrating thing is, you know, we really care about this community.

And so I read you the, the town code section 300 Dash 26 B, and we've detected 75% of the time in the last six months, there have been code violations, and nothing happens.

It's very difficult to see something happen, very difficult.

And it's very frustrating for our employees because just with the example of, it was Friday, it was Friday.

I came in to work, right at about five.

After eight, I had six different employees saying, oh my God, the the order from the landfill.

It's trapped in the front office.

So what do you do?

The county health department is telling us, if you smell this odor, this land forget you should open the doors and windows.

If I open the doors and windows, more landfill odor is going to get trapped up in the front offices.

So, you know, I sympathize with our employees.

They are they are great people.

But but how frustrating do you think it is to them when I'm putting all this red tape and going through the chain of command at the town level and nothing is happening, and then you have a vote, like you just said, I think that's the most eye opening thing you hold off on voting on an operating permit, the local town operating permit for a calendar year because of ongoing odor issues.

Yet three of the five did a 180 in March and voted for it.

So it's just it's very it's very frustrating when you're a business, when you're employing over 100 people, when they have to show up to work and we have to worry, is it going to be a bad odor day or or a normal day?

Yeah.

Let me get Michelle on this and then Joseph and Hector, I'll take your phone call in a second.

Then I've got a pile of emails to read.

I, I do understand the argument.

I will say this.

I do understand the argument that if you're the governor's office or if you're the state desk and you see the town board voting to greenlight this, it makes it hard for the DC to to believe that the opposition is that virulent.

so I but the supervisor of Seneca Falls disagrees with that.

He thinks that that that really isn't relevant.

It's not pertinent to what the state's going to do.

It's entirely up to the state.

Our guests who are on the line with us, who oppose the expansion of this landfill, say that that ignores what they think is the reality of how these decisions are going to get made here.

and I will say, Michelle, I want to get your take on this.

You mentioned that as a Waterloo resident, you're right next door, but you don't get the benefits of a lower tax bill that Seneca Falls residents get.

you know, Seneca Falls is the beneficiary in so many ways of this landfill.

If there are benefits, at least in terms of economics, I don't recall the part of It's a Wonderful Life where Jimmy Stewart is dancing on the landfill.

I must have missed that part.

But, I mean, it has become this part of Seneca Falls lower.

Would you take a $500 deduction in your local taxes, and then would that change your mind as Waterloo resident?

Is that would that sway you at all?

absolutely not.

I think that if you don't have your health, then what do you have?

I mean, you could have millions of dollars, they could offer me millions, and I don't think I would take it to live closer to the dump for the rest of my life and for my children and my grandchildren.

at some point when when that happens.

no.

I completely would love to, have this massive landfill close.

it's something that we have thought about moving on multiple occasions, but with three children in school and our jobs here, you know, obviously that's a vast undertaking.

and they do their ages now that, you know, they want to finish, you know, their middle school out here, high school here.

And so it would be really difficult to do that.

I think that back to the accountability of the dump.

I'm someone who calls regularly, even though it is inconvenient, it is tiresome.

I constantly call, I've been at baseball games and football games where there's 45 people with their shirts over their noses because they can't breathe, and the kids are coughing on the football field.

And I call, and then they say that somebody gets that, you know, again, this is someone who's who's been working in this, environment for the past however many hours.

And then you get something in the mail a couple days later, and every time it's like we went to the site and there was no odor detected.

So you can imagine the frustration when you're standing amongst your peers, and people from other towns, which is very embarrassing that come here to play against us, you know, in games and they can't breathe.

And so there could be 50 to 100 people standing there all smelling it.

And then you get the report and it says there was no odor detected.

And so it's kind of like, I don't know how they're being held accountable and exactly what they're doing.

But if the DC is getting these reports saying that they're not smelling any odor, they're obviously false records because the smell is unbearable to the point where you cannot take a deep breath and you get some headaches, nausea, dizziness.

It's absolutely atrocious the way it makes you feel.

All right, let's get some feedback from listeners.

this is Joseph in Hector.

Hey, Joseph.

Go ahead.

Hi, Evan.

thanks for taking my call.

Sure.

one quick thing, when you were talking, I was listening to your intro to the show, and you mentioned the 6000 tons a day of garbage that's going up there, and I. I think you said that equates to, 12,000 tons.

It's really 120,000 pounds, not 12,000.

So just a real quick, correction there.

and I also want to take issue with, Supervisor Schmidt, his estimation of, you know, 50% of the people just go about their, their daily lives when they're when they're inundated with this, this unbearable stench.

I don't think that's that's correct either.

but what I really want to point out was, I live in the, in the heart of the Finger Lakes wine and tourism industry.

I live on the east side of Seneca Lake and, I've watched, this industry take off and become really a world class destination.

We see people from, if you go to the Watkins Glen State Park, you'll hear, you know, ten, 12 different languages being spoken.

so people really do come here from, from all over.

And, the, the northern gateway to the Finger Lakes wine and Tourism and, region is exit 41 off the Thruway.

First thing you see is, Del Lago casino and resort and, and then you head south to, to to come to the, the wineries and, and restaurants and DVDs or whatever.

And, you drive right by this 280ft tall, massive, stinking pile of garbage.

you know, so what a welcome to, to a world class tourist destination.

And that's really all I had to say.

Well, Joseph, thank you, I appreciate that.

And by the way, I'd never trust connections.

Math, especially mine.

But thank you, Joseph.

yeah.

6000 tons a day.

It's a lot of trash.

And, if you're just joining us, it's the largest landfill in the state.

That's kind of mind boggling for some people who realize that, well, the trash can't all be coming from us.

A lot of it comes from downstate New York City in that area.

And so the question is, does it get capped now as it was supposed to be, or do they do the operators get another 15 years to bring in trash and expand this already really, really large landfill.

So other feedback.

Thank you.

Joseph.

Ariel writes to us to say the towns of parent and and Macedon are going through the same thing with the High Acres landfill, because it conveniently straddles two different towns in two different counties.

It is an absolute boondoggle to manage, and odors remain out of control for residents for miles around, depending on which way the wind is blowing.

That's from Ariel, on YouTube, also on YouTube, on the Sky news, YouTube feed, Sydney says, I find it astonishing that a landfill like this is so close to a famous village like Seneca Falls.

The mountain of garbage severely detracts from the tourist attraction that is Seneca Falls.

that comes from Sydney.

Patrick wants to know who owns this land.

I think some names should be thrown around so we know who is the man behind the curtain.

Is.

It's not the town board?

No.

That's correct.

Patrick.

The town of Seneca Falls does not own this landfill.

Yvonne Taylor, what should people know about the ownership here?

Yes.

Thank you.

Waste Connections is owned by Texas No Relation Corporation.

So no.

No.

And, you know, so they're the ones this out of state for profit corporation is the owner of this landfill.

They have no real ties to Seneca Falls.

And, you know, for that matter, you know, we now have the first female governor in New York State.

And it's really, you know, she is facing whether or not to literally trash the birthplace of women's rights.

Seneca Falls on her watch, which we believe would be a huge political black eye for her.

so now that we have to set our sights on the governor and her Department of Environmental Conservation, everybody needs to speak out and say, enough is enough.

Shut this landfill down.

844295 talk.

Listeners, if you want to join the conversation.

84429582552636 for calling from Rochester.

2639994.

You can email the program connections@wxxi.org.

K s says embarrassment is right.

What an abuse of one of the most special natural locations in the world, the Finger Lakes.

As long as the money is the be all, end all, it's just another sad trade off that is from kiosks.

And Michael says I'm part Seneca and the Finger Lakes is sacred territory.

Why does it have to be desecrated and polluted with garbage from New York City?

Get rid of the landfill.

That's from Michael.

Well, let me ask all three of our guests about this.

I understand Michael's sentiment there, but realistically, this is not about getting rid of a 400 acre landfill.

This is about whether it gets the chance to expand for another 15 years.

So what's the ideal situation?

Yvonne, I mean, I don't know if ideal is the right word, but what what is the optimal situation?

Let me ask all of our guests.

I'll start with you, man.

Taylor from Seneca Lake Guardian.

What should happen next year and what should happen going forward with that property?

So the sooner that landfill is closed and capped, the sooner the emissions, the harmful, forever chemical fast latent leachate, production reduces, the sooner people can get back to living their lives and enjoying their homes with their families.

and so, I mean, this landfill is full.

If they expand, they'll be putting 6000 tons of garbage atop a former Superfund site for another 15 years.

it has to close and for those who keep saying, well, if it closes, what are we going to do to the garbage has to go somewhere.

That is exactly the question that waste connections wants you to be stymied with, because that is not the question to be asking.

The question is, will New York State start implementing its own solid waste management plan?

It's a multi hundred page document that is a roadmap to reducing the amount of waste in the first place.

robust recycling statewide, robust composting statewide and using landfills as a last resort.

The solutions are there.

We just need the political capital to get to those solutions.

But that could take months or years.

And at least in the short term, is there a place for this trash to go to?

That's not Seneca meadows.

Yvonne.

Yes, there are 27 active landfills in New York state currently.

most of them, 25 of them have additional capacity, enough capacity to take this waste while we're turning this huge throwaway culture ship around and moving toward zero waste in a circular economy.

And those landfills are not in then identified disadvantaged communities that are harming people directly.

they're farther away.

And they, you know, they're not, you know, close to the Cayuga Nation, for example.

so the solution is there.

We just need to, to do it.

Okay.

Let me ask Mark Pettifer.

a little bit more about that idea about, you know, when Michael says shut down the landfill or get rid of the landfill, I don't know that that is likely, but what is the ideal situation for you at Waterloo?

Container there.

Mark.

Well, it's like you said, the you know, they're requesting a 15 year expansion.

And let's just be honest, they already signed their agreements.

They already got their expansion.

That expansion was till 2025.

And I'll never forget it was 2021.

And I read the headline that they, were seeking an expansion to go till 2040.

And every single person you talked to was shocked.

And that's why I want to take the opportunity to express we are neighbors with these people.

These are hardworking men and women that have an essential job to do.

And our battle is not with these employees.

Waste connections.

As Yvonne Taylor mentioned, waste connections through over $400,000 since 2019 into just the Town of Seneca Falls local election or influence between mailers and radio and websites, etc.

etc.. That's the impact.

The impact is you can't even tell people the facts.

You can't even tell them the truth because they're blindsided left and right by Mailer, after Mailer after Mailer.

So you know.

But the good news is, you know, Governor Hochul is familiar with Seneca Falls.

And I'd like to we'd like to thank her for for coming here as often as she does.

She knows what's at stake.

And we're hopeful that she'll make, the right decision.

But I think, Evan, I didn't want to leave without saying what Yvonne Taylor mentioned about the the expansion, not just me.

And, an actual expansion.

They actually have to dig up part of the former Superfund site, which is buried beneath before the deck existed, before liners existed.

You can't even imagine what was thrown in there now.

Okay.

For for certain standards, maybe it has settled or whatever they want to say, but the fact before us remains the same.

They have to dig out the landfill, then they have to realign it, and they have to place 15 years at 6000 tons a day on top of that, it's no secret that the wells surrounding the landfill are all contaminated.

If not most of them.

It's just it's a tragedy.

So the ideal situation is they stick to their original agreement.

They get held to their original agreed upon, closure date.

And, you know, there will still be, maintenance of course, there will be, years, decades of maintenance that will have to take place.

But like Yvonne said, once it's capped, the odor will decrease substantially.

Obviously, the truck traffic will decrease significantly.

The gall nuisance, the seagull nuisance, the dust, all of that stuff will start to get less and less and less.

And for a business that's already established, that's 45 years in the wine and craft beverage industry.

We would like to expand.

We would like to expand.

by the way, the Seneca Falls population is just below 7000 people.

And this is a company that no one denies the fact they have spent tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of dollars on local government races, this out of town company.

So they've been very effective at doing that.

I will say that.

and Michelle Gillan, I've got an email from Jake wants to know what can anybody do?

Will you get involved, Michelle?

What would you tell people they can do about this?

Yeah, I mean, I first started getting involved by, attending a rally years ago when they wanted to expand.

You know, the first time when I moved back to this area and then I started writing letters, because I felt like I needed to, to get my opinion over to, you know, the local governments and state state government.

I write letters and emails to the DNC because I feel like if I'm not doing it, then, maybe they're not hearing, like what?

It's what is at stake here and and the numbers.

One thing I wanted to mention, I've been my oldest is 16.

I also have a 13 year old and a ten year old.

I have never, ever heard of such high numbers of pneumonias at our school, in our school districts.

And with the kids are my children's ages and asthma.

The numbers of pneumonia that I've heard about this year and last year are like record high.

And the asthma that these kids have is unbelievable.

Everybody has an inhaler basically at the school now.

and so to be able to play in these gyms when they get filled with the smells and on the athletic fields is unbelievable.

so I just started trying to get involved, and I got pulled into a couple groups, one with, you know, that's how I kind of have met other people in the area who also oppose it.

I, I do know Mark.

you know, Yvonne and I have met and, and I have been going to the different supervisor meetings and just trying to do as much as I can.

Rajesh says watching on YouTube says on our way to Keuka Lake, we take the next exit off 90 just to avoid the landfill because the smell is abominable.

I know there are other people feel that way.

So, Yvonne, as we get ready to close the program, there is a town board meeting tomorrow night in Seneca Falls.

I think you guys are doing something, anything you want to leave with listeners?

Yvonne Taylor yes, if you've been listening to this program and you are concerned and you think you want to hold the Seneca Falls Town Board responsible, please join us tomorrow.

It's April Fool's Day, ironically so Tuesday, April 1st at 515.

We're going to meet outside, ahead of their meeting at 130 Ovid Street, Seneca Falls.

Please join us to express your disappointment.

Yvonne, thank you for making time for this program today.

Thank you.

Co-Founder and vice president of Seneca Lake Guardian, Mark Pettifer with Waterloo Container.

Mark, thanks for cutting into your workday to talk to connections today.

Thank you so much, Evan.

Michelle Gillan, a local parent there in Waterloo.

Good luck to your family.

Michelle.

Thanks for being with us.

Great.

Thanks, Ivan, and our thanks to the supervisor of the Town of Seneca Falls, Frank Schmidt, for being generous with his time this morning and recording that interview as well.

Thank you, Mr.

Supervisor.

The board, other board members are welcome any time on connections to talk about this issue from all of us.

Thank you for listening.

Thank you for watching on the auctioneer's YouTube channel.

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