>> For WXXI.

This is Connections filling in for Evan Dawson.

I'm Gino Fanelli.

Today's connection was made a little over five years ago, when then Governor Andrew Cuomo signed the Marijuana Regulation and Taxation Act into law.

That law legalized recreational cannabis in New York and set the groundwork for a multibillion dollar industry in the state.

It also did something no other state had placed equity at the forefront, while other states had made promises to ensure the people most harmed by prohibition, namely people of color and those from heavily policed communities, had a seat at the table.

New York set out with an eye towards an industry run by people who were from those communities, most notably, it set out for people who had previously been criminally charged under former marijuana laws to get a first crack at the industry.

So today, we're joined by the leaders of bloom Rock, a nonprofit cannabis incubator here in Rochester, to discuss how that effort is going, what still needs to be done.

And, you know, some of the ideas that can kind of get us to the goal of this equity that we set out for.

So on the phone, we have Precious Brown president of bloom Rock.

Precious.

Thanks for being here.

>> Thank you for having us.

Thank you so much.

>> And we will be having Chad Anderson, Vice President, bloom Rock in the studio.

We're waiting for him.

He just walked in the door.

Uh, so, um, we are joined by Chad Anderson, vice president of bloom Rock, to talk more about some of these things.

And, uh, I'll let you, uh, get situated and get your headphones on.

We can get started here.

>> Beautiful, beautiful.

>> So before we get into like some of the details of the law, the industry, all of that, and, you know, some of the things that need to be worked on to make sure we have a really vibrant cannabis industry here.

I wanted to give you both a chance to kind of walk through your path into the cannabis industry.

And what led you to doing this work?

>> Absolutely, absolutely.

>> Absolutely.

>> Yeah.

Precious.

You can go first.

>> Yeah.

So, you know, we talked about this before, Gino.

Um, you know, I consider myself a plant pioneer.

I've been doing this for well over 25 years.

When I say doing this in the cannabis industry, um, you know, in distribution and logistics and the dominated market at that time.

And then as we came out of prohibition, now just being more of a resource to our community, ensuring that individuals that see themselves in the industry and wanting to own and operate a license within the regulated market.

Um, we created a non-for-profit organization to ensure that those possibilities are there.

>> And Chad, how about you, what led you into this industry and the work you're doing now?

>> Absolutely, absolutely.

First of all, I do want to apologize for my tardiness.

>> No.

>> You're fine.

I, I get going, but just like precious said, you know, we had the conversation before, um, you know, and just like I told you.

As for me, it was, it was about the accessibility, um, you know, right after college, I was with a friend of mine.

We were going to get our, um, dispensary license figured out that was kind of out of reach as far as the card program went back in 2021, let's say.

So then we kind of transferred over to the consultant, to the consulting side, having done all the research, knowing all the information, met a lot of the people to be able to once again help the accessibility for what that looks like, other entrepreneurs to be able to be in the shoes that we wanted to fill and then like purchase that from then kind of, you know, expanded to a lot of different projects.

Things like bloom rock, um, highly efficient waste management, you know, and so on and so forth.

That kind of really helped solidify what we're doing in the not only the city of Rochester cannabis industry, but also just the New York state adult use cannabis industry.

>> So kind of I mentioned the top of the hour New York State, when it legalized recreational cannabis.

It was really put into forefront, something that no other state had done, that it was really, really focused on this undoing the past harms of criminalization.

And, uh, you know, making sure that we had an equitable industry that was run by the people that had already, you know, been in the cannabis industry well before legalization.

Um, and that, yeah, that was a rocky start.

Um, if we can be honest about it, that when those original card licenses were being rolled out, there were several lawsuits that kind of, uh, jammed up the, the works of getting the industry up to where it's supposed to be.

>> And I would even say, sorry, in the Finger Lakes region specifically.

>> Yeah, yeah.

>> Rochester's, you know, was, was saw a detrimental hit just in as far as what progression actually looked like, you know, precious definitely correct me if I'm wrong, but we didn't see our first dispensary, you know, comparative to other cities like Buffalo and Syracuse until 8 to 9 months after everybody else had already had their up, you know, their first ones going.

So that was definitely tough for us.

>> I mean, to that point, Chad, you know, we had to wait an additional two years to come out of prohibition, the Finger Lakes regions, because of, you know, the the lawsuits that were, you know, heavily hit within our region.

Absolutely.

>> And for, uh, listeners who don't know this lawsuit, that was the lawsuit that was a, I believe, a Michigan based company that wanted to open up in New York.

Um, they had done this similarly in California.

They kind of have gone around and gone state by state, uh, to challenge these provisions that it was essentially discrimination for them not to be able to operate in New York when that lawsuit was being settled, it opened up region by region across the state, the Finger Lakes region where Rochester is, was the last.

>> The.

>> Literal last to to get open.

And on that note, too, I mean, I've worked with quite a good amount of dispensary owners that were trying to get their doors open during this time and, uh, you know, kind of the years that followed as the trickle of openings happened.

And I wanted to get a sense from both of you of what kind of effect do you think this had on people that were trying to open their doors at that point in time?

And, um, you know, did it weed anyone out?

No pun intended.

But did it weed anyone out of the market by having to wait that long to actually open their doors?

>> Right.

I think.

>> That's a great question.

I think, um, Chad, I don't know.

You can go first.

>> Yeah, yeah, yeah, I would just say I think that I think it was still early enough in the market that the glimmer of hope was strong enough that personally, I don't know of anybody that is specifically weeded out because, you know, let's just kind of think about where we are in the landscape also at this point is, you know, like we said, cannabis was just legalized.

It's a lot of card applicants who, you know, gratefully that they were able to get actually their final license.

So, you know, when it was like, okay, now things are on hold in terms of what it looks like to actually bring your license to operation ability.

I think that the threshold for patience was a lot longer at that point.

Um, you know, because like I said, this was a dream come true for a lot of these operators.

So it was like, I mean, if I had to wait five years, I would wait five years compared to the, you know, year and a half, two of them that a lot of them had to actually wait.

I think that it was sustainable.

Um, at that point specifically, that's why I kind of prefaced that with, you know, the industry was still very young.

It was still very new, fresh and exciting.

And I think that potentially they would have even waited a little bit longer.

But, you know, now that's obviously probably a completely different story given some of the, you know, just trials and tribulations that we've been put through.

But also, you know, definitely carries with precious would have to say about that as well.

>> Yeah.

Precious, I would like to hear your thoughts on this too.

I mean, what, what effect do you think it had, uh, for people that were in that early stages of the market as everything was kind of still getting legally figured out?

>> Yeah, for sure.

I mean, I definitely don't think that, you know, it.

To Chad's point, it needed anyone out.

Um, as far as owner operator, but it was definitely a, you know, a situation for individuals who had applied, right.

And really sees themselves as a contender within the market wanting to operate, um, you know, whatever license that they're applying for, you know, making sure that they're prepared.

It was really frustrating to, to, to the individuals, right?

Having to, you know, go through, uh, and wait for the time period that they had to wait.

Um, so I think it was more frustrating, um, for any owner operator that really, you know, they were having to still pay for any location that they had, you know, so they were still going through the motions of having to deal with, you know, the logistics of owning and operating a business.

Um, but, you know, in limbo simply because of, you know, a lawsuit and litigation.

So I feel like it was more frustrating, um, for, for potential licensees.

>> Yeah.

And I do kind of want to like, take a step back and talk about why the state was doing this to begin with, what the motivation for how it approached law was.

And that was.

It's really interesting sitting here right now, five years after legalization, the stigma around cannabis is like nonexistent at this point.

I think it's treated as just a regular part of life.

Now, six years.

Well, to some degree, yeah.

>> No, absolutely.

To some, some degree.

But but also.

>> We're five years out of prohibition.

And, you know, I think that the, the state is still is still in limbo.

Uh, we still have multiple counties, you know, we have multiple municipalities, excuse me, we have villages, towns and cities that they have opted out to have a, you know, on site consumption lounge within their city, town or village, as well as a retail dispensary.

So, you know, the stigma I definitely think is still there.

We have to do a better job of ensuring that our community, um, is, is well aware as to why we are in choosing to include cannabis in our wellness regimen, as well as ensuring that we're creating a mature and informed community.

Right?

And that starts with education at the foundation.

Our government has done a great job with misinformation, and we have to do a better job of ensuring that, you know, New Yorkers have the, the, the, the information that they need in order to make the right decisions.

>> Yeah.

That was like one of those things.

Like while I was saying it, I'm remembering that like, oh, yeah, half the suburbs here, like you can't even open a.

>> Shop.

>> It out.

Yeah.

>> But, but, but my, my point being is that like, I think there's a lot of people that kind of forget at this point that ten years ago, there was people still going to jail, to prison for relatively small amounts of cannabis.

And 20 years before that, I mean, it was considered a hard street drug that people were doing real prison time, had their lives taken away for.

Absolutely something that you can just go into a shop now and buy how pretty much however much you want to.

Um, and I, I think that's kind of the, the framework that we have to look at here of, uh, when you're building this industry, this was why the state wanted to make sure that, you know, people that were most harmed by criminalization had a seat at the table.

But money talks too.

And I think the big concern has always been, and we talked about this recently, uh, is that large capital can come in and just kind of work its way and bulldoze its ways right over those laws.

So how do we, how do you think we can use education?

And, uh, you know, talk from your platform of, uh, to avoid that from happening.

And Chad, I'll start with you and then we can move to precious.

>> Yeah, yeah.

I mean, I feel like education just.

And I know that even at blue Rock, this is kind of like what we centered a lot of our different programing at different, you know, a lot of fundraisers, even a lot of our strategic partnerships off of it just has to be the core base of everything that we're doing.

So what bloom is doing a lot of recently is trying to branch out into, you know, non cannabis specific sectors to kind of garner support.

Like I said, whether that's from, you know, potential sponsors, um, strategic partners, you know, other individuals that we can potentially help with some of the services that we're offering in adjacent industries.

And I think that whenever we're having this, you know, specific outreach, we're always talking about the education.

I think we break it down first in terms of, okay, well, who are we really?

And what are we representing when in those two questions, we're getting the point across of, okay, the programing, like you said, we're getting back to the different franchises of all the, all the, um, most severely harmed individuals from, from the failed war on drugs.

So I think just kind of saying in all that we have to first, I think, acknowledge the past to then look at the present and look forward to the future.

So like I said, in that entire kind of formula, letting them know, yes, cannabis was at one point, you know, X, Y, Z, cannabis is now x, y, Z. Moving on into the future, cannabis has the potential to do x, y, z because I think when you break it down like that, I even know I've been doing a lot of conversation with precious about how do we really actually get our politicians and, you know, et cetera.

To listen to us.

We break it down to the economics, right?

A lot of the things that we're that we have as legislative priorities are broken down to the economics.

How do you see the money moving around in your specific municipality to make you care about what the actual cannabis revenue is doing?

And then, you know, kind of going from there, breaking down each kind of different sect of what the cannabis industry actually actually is and making sure they understand.

Because even when, you know, people we've been working with for some time, there's even still just a lot of misinformation and confusion.

And even before I say before I finished and passed off the precious, I would even say that it is no help on what's going on at the federal level, because I think it's confusing a lot of people.

Um, in terms of, you know, yes, very true.

Cannabis is still illegal at a federal level.

It's still a scheduled substance.

But I think with a lot of the movement of potential rescheduling, that hasn't been helpful.

And then with, you know, individual states having their own legalization laws, that isn't helpful because then when you really start having conversations with individuals, they're like, well, is this even truly illegal substance?

And it's like, well, for my state law, yes.

But then it's like, technically, can you even cross state lines with it?

And it just kind of gets a little bit confusing, which I think some of the misinformation comes from.

So which is why I even say following that formula, acknowledging what it was, acknowledging where we are now and acknowledging what the future of cannabis looks like is, you know, going on repeat the right way to really break down the stigma and get the point across.

And then once again, just kind of connecting anything to economics.

You know, people are going to listen about the money.

>> Absolutely.

Absolutely.

I 100% agree with that, Chad.

And to add on to that, you know, we're continuously within bloom talking about what does it look like to participate in government, right?

Um, how do you remain civically engaged?

And I think, you know, utilizing the cannabis industry and the legalization and decriminalization of cannabis within the state of New York is a great example, especially if you are, you know, wanting to be an owner operator or licensee, right?

How do you participate in government within the cannabis industry?

What does it look like to understand?

What are the regulations?

The regulations might also be considered the rules, right?

So for us, you know, within cannabis with within bloom, we are always trying to meet the community where they are.

And, and at the same time, we're always saying, you know, slow things down to speed things up so that they have a very good understanding as to, you know, how they can participate within the regulated market, understand that, you know, we are really in the business of compliance.

We're just selling cannabis, but this is more so about compliance.

And at the same time, ensuring that they have everything that they need as far as the business acumen to run a legal, a legal operated business in a successful way.

So, I mean, and to Chad's point, you know, um, it's definitely about acknowledging the past, celebrating the present in a regulated market and planning relentlessly in the future.

Um, you know, we know that it's not legal federally, right?

But understanding what does it look like to operate within your state laws?

Right?

And that goes back to, you know, participating in government.

And at the same time understanding, you know, what does it look like to be civically engaged in the entire process?

Um, and we're consistently trying to make sure that our entrepreneurs that seek the assistance of bloom via our incubation, they have everything that they need in order to be successful within the market.

>> Um, and when we're talking about the market right now, I think we've just spent some time talking about money.

And I want to give some scope of like how much money we're talking about here.

Um, last year, New York in just retail sales exceeded $2 billion in cannabis.

I was looking at some projections through 2030 three gram market, uh, gram market research sees it going up to 6 billion, higher than 6 billion.

I've heard projections all over the board of how many how much New York's cannabis industry could be worth.

But it is, I think it's remiss not to mention how rare it is that a multi-billion dollar industry opens up for a state effectively overnight, at least legally.

We.

The market is always been there, but it is not, uh, it's not been able to be accessed in this way and be formalized in this way that it is now.

And, um, I think that again, if we're going to talk about past harm and the past harms of criminalization, money now flowing in legitimately into state tax dollars, what would you like to see that do to be reinvested into our communities to kind of make a difference from the damage that's already been done from the decades of prohibition?

>> Absolutely.

>> Yeah, that's a good question.

You know, we consider ourselves proximate leaders.

Um, from Rochester, you know, looking and aware as to, you know, what's happening on a daily or weekly monthly annual basis within the city.

Um, so it's extremely important to understand, you know, what does it look like to be able to provide sound solutions and work with other community based organizations, um, that are, you know, looking to provide those sound solutions.

And so I think at the foundation of that, it goes back to, you know, ensuring that the children, right, our children, the youth, um, they have everything that they need to be successful.

So I think working with, you know, the municipalities that have opted in as well as our elected officials, our legislators to ensure that, you know, community based organizations that, you know, are there suggesting those sound solutions, um, to, to provide those programs and services, you know, for the communities most impacted by, you know, the war on drugs we like to use, you know, really kind words such as disproportionately impacted, but really we were devastated by prohibition, right.

And so I think that we could utilize the, the tax revenue that's generated for community reinvestment in a grand way.

Um, we are always looking at bloom Grok to work with other community based organizations.

We never want to work in a silo, right?

Um, to, to provide those sound solutions and programs to, to the community.

So I think it's, it's on a broad scale.

I think we're going to need the, the assistance of municipalities.

So like your city councils, your town council, your village council, as well as your, you know, elected leaders and just leaders and competent, caring, kind community members that see themselves, you know, really wanting to provide those solutions.

Uh, and, and again, I think those solutions, you know, it's going to be customized, right?

Based on, you know, what's happening within the community.

And I think that those solutions are going to come from proximate leaders, right?

And that's why, I mean, and we, we consistently revert back to that within bloom.

Um, it's extremely important for us that Rochester, um, as, as we continue to, to, to come out of prohibition, that, you know, the other municipalities that have chosen to opt out of receiving the tax revenue that they understand the implications of what it looks like to reinvest into the community by receiving that tax revenue.

So, you know, just really wanting to make sure that the community understands the opportunity, full spectrum as well.

>> Yeah, I would definitely echo everything precious is saying.

And, you know, two, two additional things I wanted to add.

One is we actually have, um, a programing portion.

It's called our town halls, you know, very kind of simple.

We actually have a lot of the conversations like these in terms of, you know, once again, we even kind of dating all the way back, you know, I don't, I don't want to go back to the origin story, but bloom Rock was formed from the Office of Cannabis Management, reaching out to organizations that were operating within Rochester, New York to be technical assistance providers, meaning that we're helping them with, you know, document, um, you know, large words, pretty much we're helping them get applied and get their applications.

So for us, when we're, when we're having these town halls, we're really trying to figure out, okay, that's approximate leadership, right?

They reached out to about 70 organizations all across the state.

So then going back to the town halls, we're calling out, you know, like precious said, caring, competent community members to say within your neighborhood of Brighton, you know, what does this look like?

What is this?

You know, cannabis tax revenue look like within your neighborhood of the northeast district of the city of Rochester?

What does this look like?

What where are the gaps at in your communities?

How can we identify them?

How can we fill them?

And honestly, from these conversations we've had Council Member Mitch Gruber show up, as well as Senator Jeremy Cooney.

So, you know, really just once again, kind of to what Preston was saying, just showing our at least local electeds, you know, caring enough to actually know this is where the real conversations are happening.

So I just wanted to put that out there, you know, to invite if anybody has an idea on, hey, I think this could be a good thing that some of this cannabis tax revenue can, can go towards.

We're opening the doors, you know, to come have a conversation with us so we can make sure their right ears are hearing it.

And then secondly, I know, you know, we've been talking about this for a while.

Like pressure said the kids 100%, but also I think a decent amount of it needs to be focused on sustainability of our market.

Um, you know, I'm sure we're going to talk about it in a little bit.

A lot of people are just transparently struggling right now.

You know, people are on the verge of closing their doors, which is, you know, one of the most terrible, the saddest things here, especially being a lot of these individuals, are socioeconomic equity license holders.

So I think with this money coming in, there needs to be some sort of allocations to ensuring, you know, these licenses can continue to open and continue to operate and continue to sell legalized cannabis.

Because if not, like we said, you know, the alternative that looks like big money coming in, buying them out potentially of the hole that they're already in.

And then that looks like a completely different, you know, market from the socioeconomic equity market and ecosystem.

At least we've been building in Rochester, New York.

So I think within Rochester, um, you know, I know we've had a lot of conversations with our council about it.

Some of it needs to go towards the sustainability of the current market that we're in or else, you know, it will look very different in the next 2 to 3 years if we can't keep these keep these individuals doors open.

Um, you know, like I said, on top of the kids, on top of kind of all the actual community work, I think at least 35 to 40% of that needs to be allocated back to the cannabis industry to ensure that we can keep growing that pot of, you know, um, tax revenue that we're obtaining from the legalized industry.

>> And again, the dollar amount, uh, comment from YouTube from Mike, um, notes that we're now at $3 billion in sales.

Um, recently.

And yeah, so, and that's really a fascinating thing because I had $2 billion last year, we're in our fourth month of, and we've already got another billion dollars in, um, that, that shows like this is a market that is rapidly growing and, uh, um, I'm gonna take a quick call from, uh, in Fairport.

>> Yeah.

Thanks for taking my call.

I think the discussion today, I haven't heard a word about an issue like cannabis use disorder.

I haven't heard a word about, uh, regular users, especially younger users having, um, cases, uh, around depression and schizophrenia and things of that nature.

I think we're going to look back at this experiment in legalization and promotion.

I got to say, the way city newspaper covers this is promotion of cannabis is going to is going to be a real dark spot.

Uh, you're only now hearing more about the medical issues associated with cannabis.

And I think that, uh, it's the tip of the iceberg.

Thank you.

>> Thank you.

>> Yeah.

>> Robert, thank you so much for that.

I want to say that, you know, first, I'm not a medical profession.

Um, I want to speak from a standpoint of personal experience.

Um, so I think you are correct with saying that we're, we're not speaking enough about the misuse of the plant.

Um, that, that is factual.

That's an actual thing, right?

Um, so I definitely promote healthy consumption and in all things, right.

Um, you want to have a healthy balance to, to maintain that, that homeostasis.

Um, I don't think that cannabis is for everyone.

So I'm never, and I'm rarely, I'm never or rarely talking about and promoting the consumption of cannabis.

We're talking about the business of cannabis, right?

And, and what it looks like to be an owner operator within the market.

Um, I definitely do think that we need to be well aware as to, you know, what it looks like for someone to consume responsibly.

Um, and at the same time, understand what they are consuming.

And so, um, I would also say that when it comes to individuals who suffer from mental instabilities, I personally have a sibling who has schizophrenia and, and they choose not to consume the plant.

So to, so to that point, I would say that cannabis is not for everyone, just like alcoholic beverages and wine and beer and other things is not for everyone.

Um, so I think it's also a personal choice.

And I think we also need to, to think about how we, um, you know, talk about the plant, right?

Because it is a plant and, and with, with understanding that, you know, why, why do we choose to include cannabis into our wellness regimen?

Um, for me, there's, there's quite a few reasons for health reasons, pain reasons, as well as to help to relax as well.

So, so I do want to acknowledge that, but I definitely want to say that I'm not a health profession, but at the same time, I'm always talking about the business of cannabis as well as when it comes to the consumption of cannabis.

I think that that's a personal individual choice.

And I think that it's definitely something that, uh, should, should, should be taken into consideration.

As with all things.

>> Absolutely.

Yeah.

Just like Pretti said, you know, definitely appreciate the call, Robert.

I think that, um, you know, even like I said, just going back to the education piece, slowing down the speed up, um, that is we, us as an organization, we have certainly touched on that before.

I definitely invite you to watch our, uh, educational learning experience.

It's on YouTube about, um, you know, was it, what does it look like to be a, a, a responsible consumer?

And we talked a lot about overconsumption, um, you know, dosing, you know, you know, just kind of going what you see in application was what I assume, you know, Robert's referring to got a bunch of high school slash, you know, post high school kids there, you know, hanging out smoking, you know, blunt after blunt after blunt.

And in that specific episode, I know, you know, precious and I were kind of talking, you know, back and forth like a setting just like this.

Like she said, neither one of us are medical professionals, but just kind of starting to break down that stigma of, okay, this isn't what you need.

And, you know, I think that even goes into some of the stigmas in terms of, you know, phrases like pothead and things like that.

Whereas like precious said, a lot of it is used for the actual health portion.

Um, but you know, like I said, we, we need help as an organization from our municipality, from individuals and partners like WXXI to really get out the word.

And you know, what safe consumption looks like and not promoting overconsumption, because I definitely agree that that's not absolutely.

Um, you know, good slash what we're trying to get across by any means.

>> Yeah, I know, and I think I should respond to that too, given that, um, you mentioned city and I write about cannabis for city and have for a long time.

And I think it's a very, very valid point that, um, there is a concern about, um, you know, safe consumption.

And, um, I think the only way you get there is through education and destigmatizing that, um, people that especially young people aren't afraid to ask questions about what's safe.

They're also, um, less susceptible to peer pressure if they know that they can say like, hey, this doesn't work for me.

And this does for if, if that stigma is broken down.

Absolutely.

But I would say too, that there's an irony in comments like this that I find, um, somewhat hollow in the sense that when it comes to reporting about alcohol, this is rarely a conversation that's brought up.

>> Absolutely.

>> When it comes to.

>> Because it's been normalized at this point.

Alcohol.

>> Exactly.

And if we want to talk about mental health issues and young people, we all have rectangles in our pockets that are linked by research to causing anxiety, depression, um, feelings of inadequacy and can lead to severe mental health disorders.

From being exposed to looking at their phones for too long to being on social media for too long, we have seen research done on that.

Are we doing anything to outlaw phones?

There's a lineup of products on every over-the-counter pharmacy that you could pick up and put yourself into a psychosis right now, if you wanted to, you could end your life with them if you wanted to.

Are we looking to outlaw all those products?

Are we looking to end that little social experiment of giving people the trust to pick out what they're selling?

Uh, selling on a store shelf and trust that they're going to be able to do something responsible with it.

So I think the point is extremely valid that we do need education and we do need to have these conversations about misuse.

But when it comes specifically to talking, saying it's reserved to cannabis and that cannabis is an experiment that will one day go away because we realize the harms of it.

One, it's not going to go away.

It was here.

It was here long before the MTA.

>> Ever passed.

Yeah, yeah.

>> And it will remain here for sure.

>> And two, um, we, if we're going to start doing that, we have to go down a pathway of addressing every single thing that is so normalized in our society that is causing, uh, true psychic damage to our children.

And, um, or we have to accept that there are risks in the world every day of our lives and that we have to do whatever we can to educate and mitigate them.

There's two choices you have there, CEO everyone up in a box and let them live in safety or teach them about the world and what works and what doesn't work.

So that would be my thoughts on that.

>> I definitely agree, I definitely agree.

>> Um, so, um, to move forward on that, um, when you're working with cannabis entrepreneurs right now, I, um, I, what, what need for help right now is most profound.

Um, oh, break.

We're going to take our first break of the hour, we'll come back and we'll talk about, uh, what are some of the needs of cannabis entrepreneurs right now?

>> I'm Evan Dawson coming up in our second hour.

My colleague Mona Seghatoleslami hosts the program talking about slam poetry, the state of slam poetry in Rochester.

As we honor Poetry Month, a conversation with Slam poets about the work that they do and the community that they form, even the activism that they are engaged with.

Mona Seghatoleslami from classical 91 five hosts.

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>> Bobjohnsonautogroup.com.

And we're back on Connections with the folks from Grok talking about the cannabis industry right now.

And before we went on the break, I was just starting to ask about, um, your work with cannabis entrepreneurs right now, dispensary owners, farmers, um, you know, people that are entering the industry right now, what is the need five years on from legalization that is most profound right now?

What is, um, when you're talking to folks and you're, you know, doing programs, what is, what are people seeking right now in terms of support?

>> Yeah, absolutely.

I would honestly start at a broad scale.

And I know precious will probably go into some of the, you know, more finite things, but we've, we've, like I said, tapped technical assistance providing, um, that was essentially, essentially that was us consulting, you know, for, you know, these, these, um, different cannabis license holders.

And in extent that was even kind of beyond our current scope slash capabilities.

But once again, I know we've even, you know, shared this with WXXI shared this with you.

That's just kind of who we are as individuals.

And, you know, we've, we've created the network that if people are going to reach out to us asking for any sort of assistance or guidance or direction, you know, although the proper resources to allocate to that might not be there, we're going to do anything that we can within, you know, Chad's power, within his power to make sure that they are getting the help that they need.

Saying all that to say, a the kind of sect we obviously didn't coin the term, but we've been calling it C continued education because that's, you know, essentially what it is, right?

It's like a lot of the individuals that we help come through the pipeline, you know, with their application, help them with deficiencies, help them kind of get into the place they are.

And then they're like, okay, that's great.

You know, now I've been open for a year and a half, you know, three years now what like, you know, I'm battling marketing, I'm battling, you know, just different products.

I'm battling compliance issues.

I'm battling, you know, the ever changing legislative landscape of, of the cannabis industry.

So now I think, and like I said, you know, going and going in at a high level and kind of letting pressures, um, get to some of those details, I feel like we're still kind of doing the same thing as we're just helping these people out with anything that, that, that looks like from, you know, this portion of their business all the way down to this portion of their business.

And sometimes that's even assisting them and helping, you know, get Connections and, you know, do things like this, you know, helping them get coverage for their specific dispensary, their specific situation and, you know, media and marketing help.

So like I said, in a very broad sense, we're doing continued education, which is, you know, backed down to the consulting thing, helping them continuously move forward and progress through their adult use license that, you know, they hold in whatever, whether that's retail cultivation, processing, distro, or microbusiness specifically.. >> Yeah, precious.

>> Anything to add there?

>> Yeah.

To add on to exactly.

As Chad said.

I mean, we are really supporting them with the continuing education.

And I would definitely say it's more so of the operations, um, of, of that license, right?

So if, you know, we are supporting a licensee that has a, you know, retail dispensary, you know, what does it look like to operate daily, weekly, monthly, annually from a compliant aspect, right?

We are always, you know, training and all licensees that we are in the business of compliance, you know, um, and we want to make sure that the employees, your bud tenders, um, as well as, you know, anyone that might be operating in direct fulfillment, every aspect of the business, they have a great understanding of that.

So, um, to, to, to Chad's point, and that's a, it's a great question, you know, how are we and how are we continuing to support them?

And what we're seeing is it really is that continuing education?

Um, we, it's not a cookie cutter experience, right?

It's more so, um, you know, it's a customized, it's a customized engagement based off of, you know, you know, you know what the licensee might need.

Um, you know, I myself, as well as Chad and, um, doctor Brandi Hester Harrell, our strategic advisor, we are always going in and ensuring that, you know, um, each licensee, especially from our incubation and cohort, um, if they're reaching out to us and they're needing that additional support, we are able to give them, if we don't have that direct answer, we're always, you know, ensuring that, you know, those resources are there for them.

Even if, you know, the allocation of compensation and dollars is not there.

>> What's the next frontier?

I think right now, we're kind of at this point where dispensaries are there's well over 600 in the state right now.

They're kind of well established.

Um, we still don't have onsite consumption though.

And, uh, I think I like answering my own question a little bit, but, you know, I think that's still a little ways off, but, um, I want you to talk a bit about like lobbying for, um, that measure in, um, the cannabis industry, um, that still has to go through some hurdles to get there.

And, uh, you know, what do you think that would bring to the marketplace here?

Um, Chad, you can start with that.

>> Yeah.

I think the next frontier looks like just like kind of anything else.

What's the next innovative thing?

Right?

So let's think about some of you know, I know we hear stories about the cannabis cafes in California or, you know, even more specifically on in not in the United States.

I think as, like you said, these, you know, deliveries still has to officially release on site consumption nursery license.

I think once those are out, it's going to come down to, okay, like you said, we're doing nothing but growing as an industry in terms of like the scale of license holders in each kind of specific available license at this time, the next thing is going to be is, okay, how can I stand apart from everybody else?

So, you know, we hope to see, you know, I know, I know we're always talking about, um, the bed and breakfast, you know, idea that, you know, precious has been wanting to do for a very long time.

The, you know, cannabis cafes, the, you know, cannabis movie theaters.

So I think that's what it's going to be because at the end of the day, like you said, this industry has been around for a very, very, very long time.

Also not going anywhere for probably a very, very, very long time, even if it ever does.

So I think it's going to be once again, you know, I hate to always bring it back to the economics, but okay, operationally, I'm doing well now.

How do I stand out economically?

What can I do to go that extra mile to make people want to specifically, you know, engage with my brand or specifically come to my store or specifically want to be a part of, you know, whatever that specifically looks like, whether, like I said, cultivation process or micro, et cetera, et cetera.

Um, and yeah, like I said, I would definitely pass it to precious to see, see what she's thinking on that.

>> Yeah.

Precious.

You have anything to add there?

>> Guys, you're breaking up.

Hello?

>> Can you hear us?

>> Yes, I can hear you now.

I'm sorry.

Say it again.

>> Uh, so, yeah, we were talking about the onsite consumption and kind of like the next frontiers of the cannabis industry.

And I want to get some of your sense of what you think some of the things are that will be, you know, major players in the next iteration of some of the growth in the cannabis industry.

>> Yeah.

>> So, you know, like I mentioned before, you know, I've been doing this for 25 plus years within, you know, distribution and, you know, operating in logistics and, um, the, uh, previous market, right.

Allegedly, um, and so as I transitioned to the regulated market, you know, we created a company called e w c entertaining and educating with cannabis, entertaining and elevating with cannabis in the hopes of, you know, securing a on site consumption license.

Um, you know, the idea was to create this safe, sophisticated space for our community to really relax, recover from the stress of the day via a bud and breakfast in upstate New York.

Um, because I've beautiful memories of upstate New York and my family is from upstate New York, well over 100 plus years within this region.

And you know, as we have continued to roll out of prohibition, the hopes of, you know, on site consumption that that it's still there.

Right.

Um, so I think that the next iteration and you know, what the market will, will look like is, is creating something that's sustainable.

Um, and, and as far as sustainable for the community and what it looks like to be, to operate intentionally and engage the plant in an intentional way.

Um, and really create those ecosystems where, you know, we're, we're educating the community where we're operating, you know, throughout the supply chain and, you know, welcoming the general public and, you know, consumers to a cannabis farm, a cultivation site, you know, going through and understanding, you know, what does processing look like?

You know, what does manufacturing look like within the industry?

And really opening up the doors for our community so that they can understand, you know, what we're doing?

We are plant pioneers, you know, where there's nothing legacy about.

We're not legacy leaders, right?

We're plant pioneers and we're forging through, um, and we really have an opportunity to, to, to, to really create a sustainable, um, market that is inclusive to the general public, but in a way that is intentional that, that, you know, includes them.

And we're explaining the, the harms of prohibition and, you know, acknowledging the harms of prohibition and planning intentionally, intentionally, um, you know, for, for a market that will be sustainable.

>> So when we talk about sustainability too, as I mentioned before, it's over 600 dispensaries in the state right now.

And I think that number is probably going to increase quite a bit.

But is there a concern of when we're going to hit a saturation point?

Um, that I'm looking from the WXXI studio, there's probably about 4 or 5 dispensaries within a reasonable walking distance or not, not too far from here.

Um, is there a concern about, um, okay, how do we, you know, get ready for the point of like, okay, the industry is hit.

It's kind of plateau level of that.

Now, um, we have to support it in maintaining that level rather than keep trying to add on more and more and more dispensaries that will ultimately close because they can't all be sustained by market.

There is going to be an upper threshold limit at some point.

So I just wanted to get both your thoughts on that, of like how you kind of, you know, push forward the sustainability in the marketplace by looking at where it could be and where is a reasonable place to consider it has leveled off.

And precious.

I'll start with you on that of, uh, how, how do you approach that kind of idea of, uh, that kind of sustainability overall?

>> Well.

>> Um, you know, with within bloom, we, in order for us to be able to provide technical assistance, we do what we call cannabis canvasing.

And so, you know, I'm well aware and tapped into the community.

Um, and understanding the individuals that are still operating in an illicit way.

They want to apply for a dispensary license or they want to apply for an on site consumption license.

Let's think about, you know, our bed and breakfast is our cannabis and coffee shops or cafe shops, right?

Um, but that, that portal or that license is an open right now.

And so those individuals past and present, they're still making hundreds of thousands of dollars monthly, right?

So the illicit market is at, I would estimate maybe $15 billion.

Okay.

So when we say, is there saturation for me?

Absolutely not.

You know, if you see yourself as wanting to be a contender in the regulated market, you should have the the same opportunity and access as anyone else.

I do not, uh, subscribe to or even understand when someone says that the market is saturated.

For me, that's a greedy individual.

That's someone who doesn't want to give someone else an opportunity because, you know, maybe you want to ensure that.

And this is hypothetically speaking, you speaking, you know, just anyone might have an opportunity to have ten, 20 plus stores or retail locations.

So I don't see where we there isn't saturation in the market right now.

We've, we've only been out of prohibition for five years.

>> Yeah.

It's, it's almost like precious took the words out of my mouth.

I, I definitely agree and I, and I think that just kind of even going back to some of my, you know, previous points, barriers to barriers to accessibility, one, like precious said, for the actual operators, I think as we kind of continue to go on throughout the market, the state will realize what does it look like to pull a lot of these, you know, operators still operating, let's call it in the gray into the market.

And I think, you know, with those operators operating in the gray, you know, we've like you said, you know, we just did 3 billion in sales.

And I don't even know if 50% of the actual population of New York State are, is purchasing cannabis from retail dispensaries.

So, you know, as, as we start to pull in a lot of those, um, you know, plant pioneer operators that are currently operating outside of the legal industry in the, in the gray market, I think along with that, we'll bring in a lot of their shoppers, which will kind of, you know, like, like precious was saying, circumvent the quote, unquote saturation that we might potentially be seeing.

But if anything, we're only seeing it because not everybody's buying cannabis that consumes cannabis.

And I feel like that's just kind of a very easy, simple to understand fact.

There's still a lot of individuals that, you know, have been going to the same individual for the last five, ten years.

Why would you switch?

Right?

You.

>> Exactly.

>> It's trusted.

You know, where it's coming from.

You know, let's say they have a little indoor cultivation, home cultivation, whatever that looks like, whatever their logistical operation looks like to get the plant from wherever they're getting it into your system.

I think that as we start to focus on bringing in the current operator outside of just kind of, you know, scrambling for anybody that we can in such an early industry, then, you know, like I said, the operators will see the value in it beyond what we're telling them, hearing it from the state.

And then, you know, their shoppers will start to follow too.

And, you know, just kind of I don't say weeding out the gray market because, you know, the gray market is always going to be there.

It's just because of, you know, certain policies around the world around this, this, this nation, you know, there's always going to be a reason to have, um, a gray, a gray market operator until we kind of see it see changes that I, I would even go as far to say the international level to, you know, because at the end of the day, we operate on an international economy, even if it's not directly, you know, represented in the micro that you live in the macro outward facing, you know, as we're seeing now, I don't want to get too much off topic, but, you know, gas is still $4.

Yeah, yeah, gas is still $4 a gallon.

And you know, that's looking at the macro economy as a whole.

So like I said, you know, just kind of reiterating everything you said, but also, you know, as we start to focus more on the people that we actually want to target and, you know, pulling some of their shoppers from the gray market to the legalized market, I think that'll, you know, like I said, circumvent any, you know, quote, unquote, um, saturation that we're experiencing.

>> And we got a few minutes left here.

So I just kind of wanted to look forward.

Um, as far as, uh, lobbying goes, um, and we look at state, county, city governments of what you think are, you know, key legislative priorities for the cannabis industry right now.

Precious, I'll start with you.

And, uh, we got a few minutes left.

So, uh, whatever you have.

>> Gino, I'm having a very hard time with hearing you all.

It sounds very distorted.

I heard you say, precious.

I'll start with you.

>> Um, so I was asking what?

Some key lobbying priorities are for, uh, what what you think?

State, local and city governments could be doing to, uh, help support the cannabis industry right now?

>> Okay.

I think I heard you say key lobbying priorities.

>> Is that correct?

>> Yep.

That's correct.

>> Okay.

Perfect.

Um.

>> So the number one that I could think of, um, so most recently bloom, we did a lobbying day within, uh, Albany, um, very successful lobbying.

We appreciate our legislators that were able to meet with us.

Um, we do feel that, you know, our concerns were heard.

Um, and, and hopefully, you know, fairly soon implemented.

And so I would say the number one would be that we're looking for the MTA Marijuana Regulation and Taxation Act to, to be implemented as it was written.

That would be the thing, right?

I think that the state agency has an implementation issue.

Uh, definitely a high turnover, but implementation, um, if we look at the foundation as to saying, you know, what, what, what could we do better?

The individuals that have been devastated by prohibition, my community has been devastated by the prohibition of a plant, you know, mass incarceration, families torn apart, you know, and so many other things.

Um, we, we, we need the law to be implemented as it was written.

We are hoping that our legislators and our local municipalities that have opted in, that they continue to see the efforts of the, the community based organizations such as bloom Rock.

We are working relentlessly to ensure that our community is well aware of the opportunities of working in a regulated market, right?

Um, we are fearless operators continuously, you know, reaching out to individuals that are operating in an illicit way and enticing them to, you know, want to operate in a regulated market.

And what does that look like to provide them with technical assistance and the resources that they need in order to be contenders and successful?

And so, you know, we're hoping that our legislators and as far as lobbying, like I said, the implementation of the Mrta as it was written, those individuals that are, you know, social economic equity applicants, right?

That would be, you know, minorities, women, uh, this disservice, uh, veterans, um, as, as well as, you know, disabled.

Excuse me, excuse me, distressed farmers and disabled veterans, um, women, minorities, uh, individuals living in CDI from 1981 to 2021.

What does it look like to be a resource for them?

So we are, we are really hoping that our legislators and at a local level, um, you know, our city councils, mayors and individuals that have opted in to receive the tax revenue, they're working with us and not against us.

>> All right.

Great.

Um, and, uh, yeah, that's just about set up for us.

Uh, Shannon, thank you both for being here.

This has been great.

And, uh, just, uh, remiss not to mention to check out the article in city this month about, uh, the work that blooms doing and, uh, yeah, absolutely.

>> Thank you so much, Gina.

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