From WXXI news this is connections I'm Evan Dawson.

Our connection this hour was made in November of 1853, when Susan B Anthony wrote in her diary about how women were expected to be subservient to men after all.

Once married, a woman could not open a bank account or enter into a contract or rent an apartment, and any income earned by a woman was legally considered to be the property of her husband.

Susan B Anthony knew that if women were to gain more power, they would have to be allowed to make their own money.

Here's what she wrote in her diary on that 1853 day quote A woman must have a purse of her own.

And how can this be so long as the wife is denied the right to her individual and joint earnings?

Reflections like these caused me to see and really feel that there was no true freedom for a woman without the possession of all her property rights, end quote, a purse of her own.

That is the theme of the 2025 Susan B Anthony Birthday celebration.

The annual event supports the National Susan B Anthony Museum and House in Rochester.

This year, the museum's keynote speaker is a Rochester man who followed an unlikely path to a rather spectacular career of her own.

Laurie Van Dusen is the founder and CEO of Elvie Advisors.

She's the author of the book running with Grace A Wall Street Insider's Path to True Leadership A Purposeful Life, and Joy in the face of Adversity.

Published in 2023, this hour we turn our attention to financial freedom.

Laurie has been helping people with that for years.

Or as Susan B Anthony might put it, a purse of her own.

My guest this hour include in studio.

Deborah Hughes is the executive director of the National Susan B Anthony Museum and House.

Welcome back to the program.

Always great to be with you, Evan.

Great to have you.

And welcome to Laurie Van Dusen on the line with us, the founder and CEO of Elvie Advisors.

Laurie, welcome.

Thank you for being with us.

Thank you.

Evan.

Hi, Deborah.

Hi, Laurie.

Nice to have you, Laurie.

And we're want to mention the listeners.

If you want to attend the event in question, it is eight.

Is it a two?

It's a Tuesday.

Is it eight days from now?

Wednesday the 12th, Debra Houston.

That right?

That is correct.

And it's an evening event.

The doors open at five.

The dinner program starts at six.

It's happening at the Rochester Riverside Convention Center on Main Street in Rochester.

I know you'd love to see the community there.

We would love to see the community there.

And they can get tickets by going to Susan b.org and clicking on the event button.

so I was telling Deborah before the program that this is the first time I'd encountered.

I feel like I know a lot of great Susan B Anthony quote largely thanks to Deborah, but, you know, because, you know Rochester, we should know our history.

this is not one that I immediately recognized.

And then it was really interesting to read that diary entry and, and think in this, in this context, what do you want listeners to understand about the context of this quote?

Yeah, the context is that she's traveling around.

She's in her early 30s.

She's traveling around New York State.

She's, the organizer for the Anti-Slavery society.

She's speaking on women's rights, and she's also speaking on temperance.

and she's traveling with Ernestine Rose, and they're going to communities and discovering places where women had organized the year before and absolutely nothing had happened.

And she's trying to figure out what, why?

Why haven't they've done what they they were planning to do?

they were planning to bring in speakers and educate the public.

And, and she realizes it's the shortage of resources.

they don't have funds to bring in speakers.

They don't have property in which to hold events.

and so it's this huge moment when she realizes that it's really preventing them from doing what they feel called to do.

Not only I imagine and thinking through what she's saying there, Deborah.

Not only do women not have resources to bring in speakers, organize events, pay for whatever they need to pay for, but society expected them to get the permission of their husbands to do any of that.

Right.

Absolutely.

Yes.

That was a whole piece about it.

And I'm trying to think of how Susan they felt, you know, spending the idea that she's going to spend the rest of her life asking permission from a man for what she can and can't do.

Well, and at this point, she's retired from a very successful career in teaching where she could expect to earn a quarter for every dollar a man is paid.

she won awards for her teaching, but still, she could not be paid the full wage, a quarter of every dollar.

I mean, we talk about the gap, and, you know, that's something that continues to get a lot of focus.

But a quarter for every dollar.

So that's the context is.

So if you hear throughout this hour a purse of her own, there's the context for that quote.

And and that's a it's an interesting theme.

I know you like to bring different aspects of what Susan B Anthony was fighting for at various points in her life and career to this birthday celebration.

Why that theme this year?

Deborah?

Well, we actually selected the theme, back in the spring, not knowing where we'd be politically this year.

it was partly that idea of, when people are working for social change, how do you do that?

And Susan B Anthony is a great role model.

Also, her passionate belief in democracy and the idea that we would be a better society if we would have everyone involved and doing the hard work of, electing people and having government that serves the people.

Before I turn to Laurie and we're going to kind of get into her book, which is, a really easy read.

And, has got a lot of powerful, points in her life.

Laurie has been through a great deal, and we're going to talk about how she has overcome so much in that we learned in this book, running with Grace.

Before we do that, I want to ask you, Deborah, you know, I've gotten to know you over the years.

and I have never how I want to put this.

I never found you to be overtly political because of the work that you do.

You serve the entire community.

Frankly, you don't just serve the community.

You're the National Museum and house.

I mean, you serve anybody who wants to learn the story to to contribute to the story, to understand, the importance of Susan B Anthony and this movement.

And I've always admired that about you.

I mean, I know there's moments where it must feel difficult not to be overtly political.

Has that become more difficult, or do you think certain ideas shouldn't be politicized, even though it feels like everything is politicized?

Susan B Anthony, fortunately, was very clear about being nonpartisan.

she really believes that political parties, you know, it's part of the essence is for them to succeed.

And if you aligned yourself with a political party, you might be on board with the whole program.

and that that's not healthy government, that really the electorate should always be accountable to everybody.

I think that's one of things that I really like about Susan B Anthony is she calls us back to the better vision of what democracy can be.

It certainly is true right now that, because so many phrases have been categorized in one bucket or another, it's awfully hard to say something that isn't perceived to be that one.

We're it shouldn't be anything experienced that too.

you know, she was more often called a radical than anything else.

and we forget that, she didn't live to see women get the right to vote.

She saw a huge amount of change in her lifetime.

but these are the key issues.

This is really democracy.

Was this brand new experiment when she was born?

50 years old.

And this.

Could we actually have a government of the people?

By the people?

For the people.

And to me, that's the vision that we, are trying to push forward at the Anthony Museum.

and it's it's all about humanity.

It's not about one time or another.

When did you meet Laurie Van Dawson?

we're.

I think the first time I met was when you came to an event.

The neighborhood walk around at the Anthony house.

I think that was the first time.

Yeah.

Now, a several several years ago.

And I was just kind of blown away.

Walking through that neighborhood.

Laurie, can you describe what it means to you to have the role to keynote for the birthday of Susan B Anthony?

I mean, sort of an important figure.

Sort of important.

Yeah.

it's it's humbling.

it's it's an honor.

And, I feel that, you know, in preparing for this talk, I kind of.

I feel her and I, I want to channel her, you know, and that's kind of my goal is to maybe teach people things that, about Rochester, about our history, about what she actually did and how, it impacted me more.

More than I even knew before I started working on this speech.

I certainly know, like everybody else, a school child.

We grow up, we learn history.

But when you really dig into it and then you live a life and you think about how she paved the way for all of us.

And she was from our town and said, it's, remarkable honor to be a person to speak at an event like this.

Laurie, I want to, I want to let listeners know.

right off the bat here, without being sort of sensationalistic.

And for those watching on the Sky news YouTube channel, this is the book it's running with Grace A Wall Street Insider's Path to true leadership, a purposeful life and joy in the face of adversity.

it is remarkably frank about a lot of, painful, painful moments.

And, so the short version and I don't say this to be sensationalistic because we'll talk about some of this in more detail, but, the short version is Laurie Van Dusen maybe originally thought, well, I'm going to be in theater or vocal performance, was a very good singer, but was told by a professor, you know, you're you're good.

There's a lot of people who are good.

Like, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe do something else.

She ends up going to Harvard.

before she graduated from Harvard, she was raped by a PhD and had to decide whether to go to authorities and was worried that she might lose her chance to complete, her education at Harvard if she told anybody in authority chose not to tell.

Finished Harvard.

and I think 25, 26.

Diagnosed, with the tumor.

Thankfully, it wasn't cancer and needed a pretty major surgery.

We're covering from that, loses her beloved grandfather, and then gets hired to go to Lehman Brothers, of all things, which we're going to talk with Laurie about.

Like, of all the firms that you go to Wall Street and start with, you know, a lot of Americans know that name.

And this was in the 1980s.

She goes to Lehman Brothers and this culture of sexual harassment, a challenge for for women to succeed and be respected.

Well, Laurie does all of that.

She does.

And amazing creates this amazing career, and really ends up being kind of the person that a lot of people on the outside would say, well, that woman has it all.

And then she loses her husband to suicide, during the pandemic, of all things, and has had to find a way to bounce back, bounce back, bounce back, find a way forward.

And this book is really remarkable.

So I didn't mean to condense it like that, but that's what I want listeners to know we're going to be talking about.

It's heavy.

but, the book is, is very direct.

And congratulations on creating a book that I think is, going to help people who read it.

Laurie, why did you decide this was this needed to be a book?

I think it was decided for me.

I, when, I lost my husband when he, he decided to take his own life.

It was a shock to to everyone.

to me.

And I was somebody who, if you do read the book, you know, you know, I. I've had quite a career.

I was used to being in front of a lot of boards.

I had risen to the ranks, in a lot of ways.

I was used to kind of being able to read a room and bring people to consensus.

And, I had a lot of experiences that are in the book reading up Tehran's death, that you'd think, you know, this woman has some coping skills.

and at the time of his death, I realized all the things that I had been through.

everything, including being sued by the largest bank in the world and winning and all of these things.

None of them, prepared me, for that.

And as I said, you know, I, I learned a lot.

I don't think any of us really understand these kinds of choices that people make, but I had to put one foot in front of the other, and I had to figure out a path out.

At first, I, I, you know, you get you're just in a, PTSD is a rough thing.

That's all I'll say.

And then you you work your way through it.

And I started to journal.

I'd never been in therapy.

I'd never talked with a therapist before.

maybe I should have, but I never had.

And one, person, one therapist suggested I started start journaling.

And I'd always been a writer, and I just thought, okay.

And I started journaling.

And I'm also a long distance runner for some reason.

I think you're a runner or you're, you're an athlete or something, but I don't know.

But.

Yeah, you're talking to me.

I haven't even.

I thought you were like, well, I'm going to try to run a money sneaker in April, and it's going to be it's going to be painful.

Okay.

Well, good for you.

I think it's it's a great moving meditation, but I, I would be outside, I'd be running or, walking with my dog.

Race and something would come to me, during, you know, the first several months after Ron died and I would either I'd take my phone out and I would just create a voice memo.

I'd wake up in the middle of night, I'd write things down, and then, you know, this whole process of actually journaling and things just coming to me, led to, one day I called my younger son, and I said, you know, I think I wrote a book, and he said, what?

And he said, well, mom, you always kind of wanted to write a book now.

And I said, no, I think I wrote a book.

I think this is a book.

Can you help me?

Added it?

So he and I, went through the process of editing and then, brought his older brother in as well.

And both of them said to me, mom, we think you should publish this book.

And I wasn't sure I couldn't do it until I could be true to, I could speak the truth.

All of it, and think, you know, people don't need to know every detail of something.

But in order to really change a course or make an impact or make positive change and really to to communicate that these kind of things maybe not as traumatic, but life.

Life isn't fair.

Life is rough.

We all go through losses.

I just thought, you know, I have to be honest, but I also have to get to the point where I can honor Ron, my husband and they, my sons read the book and they were like, mom, you know, you did it.

And so then I ended up giving it to five different people that I respected who didn't know each other, who are like beta readers.

And they all said the same thing to me.

So then I hired a professional editor.

And as you can imagine, reading the book, I hired a legal team.

And, then, you know, so it's a big process.

And I remember getting it to a point where it was actually this kind of almost final manuscript.

And then I just heard this thought in my head, like, this book is not for you.

And, it's going to help people.

And so I published it, never thinking like I just kind of jumped off the cliff when I published it.

And I was in Maine, on a break, and one of my best friends called me and she said, I just got done with your book.

And I said, well, I know.

I thought that was fun.

She goes, it, it came out last night.

And, anyway, it became a Wall Street Journal bestseller, much to my.

And I'm not feigning humility here.

I really had no idea that it was.

It just was felt like the right thing to do.

Well, and I want to tell listeners, you know, we're we're going to talk about a number of themes.

We're not going to spend the hour, on Lori's husband's suicide.

But I want to just ask you about one specific aspect that you write about that I think will help people.

if you don't mind talking about it, Lori.

And that's the idea of forgiveness, forgiving yourself, also forgiving him and finding some level of peace because you write in the book that, you know, if you're being realistic, you couldn't have achieved what you achieved in your career without having pretty good intuition about people, about understanding people.

And, and yet there were certain things that inevitably someone, any of time, someone that loses someone to suicide.

You look back and you say, what did I miss here?

And that was very painful.

And so can you just talk a little bit about the process of forgiveness in that way?

Yeah.

Well, it's a key.

It's a key, part of my life.

And I think, if I could teach anyone anything.

And I'm not sure you can teach this, but you could demonstrate forgiveness.

because if you if you can't get to the point where you can forgive yourself.

And so I spent a lot of time, you know, in this place where I couldn't understand how I didn't know or I didn't see it coming, or you go through a very, now, I know, normal process of I could have prevented this if I'd only done this, this or this.

but what you learn and I'm no, you know, mental health professional, but what you learn a lot of times about, somebody who chooses to go this path and, and their own life is there.

They don't show it.

and as a matter of fact, my husband was a very proud person.

He didn't show vulnerabilities, and I had to go back.

And what I what I say to people as part of the process of forgiveness is also owning things that you should own, and letting go of the things that you couldn't have possibly known.

And I did go to very dark corners, and I did open up boxes and look at them and literally went through this whole healing process and got to the point where, I knew at 100% that it was not my fault, that there was nothing that I could have done because he chose to not talk about the struggles he was having.

so once I had gotten to that, point and it took a long time, everybody's process is going to be different around a loss, especially a traumatic loss like that.

I don't think I ever spent a day being mad at him.

I don't think I maybe there were there are certainly moments, but I don't think it was ever a day.

I was just overwhelmingly sad.

And I had to just come to grips with that.

And, my husband had a rough past as a child, and he tried to, I think, bury that in doing good things for other people, which he did.

He was a great example, for for kids.

He was a great dad.

He was a very adoring husband.

But I think when you don't work on these things from your past, at some point they catch up with you.

And it's the only way I can really understand it.

And my older son said to me, well, first of all, both my sons, I started with, you know, I should have known.

I should have known that, you know, he was struggling.

Why didn't I see it?

All of these things and and both of my sons said, well, this is not your fault.

You know what you do find out when you research this kind of thing is that suicide often is an impulsive act.

It's an in the moment thing.

And he was very impulsive.

And I think that was that was part of it.

It's it's a very complex thing to cover on a radio show.

And it isn't, it's it's in terms of the book.

The book is a healing journey.

It is about forgiveness, not just about this chapter in my life, but about a lot of things.

And if you're not living, in this way where you can ultimately forgive people, you're living in a lot of regret, which is living in the past.

Where are you living in a lot of anger and, bitterness.

And those things don't do anyone any good, but especially you.

And until you can figure out a way to forgive and to get to that point, you're living in, in your own personal hell.

So I think for me, what I realized and maybe the epiphany and all of this, is that being able to get there is a super powerful thing because you connect with people differently.

You can talk with them differently, you can understand their struggles, and you can help them get to a more positive, you know, more positive place.

But I can tell you, 100% that I not only have forgiven him, but I have forgiven myself for not understand ING or knowing.

So it has helped me understand more though.

People have been put in my path and it has not been an accident, you know, since he died.

So yeah, well, I would just endorse the idea that that, that your sons brought up to you that I think the book does honor your husband and it also really honors your sons remarkable men that you have raised.

and.

Yeah, very obviously so.

And I've never met them, but I feel comfortable saying.

So, after we take this only break the hour, we're going to come back with Laurie Van Dusen, the author of running with Grace A Wall Street Insider's Path to True Leadership A Purposeful Life and Joy in the Face of Adversity.

we're going to talk to Laurie about the career that, has really put her in this position to be able to talk about, a purse of her own and financial freedom and helping people, in their own lives.

And and in Laurie's case, being a woman on Wall Street in the 80s, when the culture, I mean, of.

We'll talk about that and a lot more with Laurie Van Dusen, who is on the line with us and in studio, Deborah Hughes, who is the executive director of the National Susan B Anthony Museum and House.

They have a big event next Wednesday.

It is the Susan B Anthony birthday celebration.

It's an evening event next Wednesday night.

That's February 12th at the Riverside Convention Center in Rochester.

Are tickets still available on the website?

doors open at five and the dinner program starts at six.

If you want to attend, they'd love to see you there we are right back with them on connections.

Coming up in our second hour, you probably saw the story when the Episcopal Bishop of Washington made headlines during the National Prayer Service with President Trump and Vice President Vance in attendance, Bishop Marianne, but called on the president to show mercy to people who are scared.

Now the president lashed out at her on social media.

Well, this hour we talked to one of that bishop's colleagues, the new bishop of the Episcopal Diocese of Rochester.

I'm connections.

Support for your public radio station comes from our members and from Great Tie Consulting, providing management consulting services to help support not for profit organizations.

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This is connections.

I'm Evan Dawson.

During a brief break.

Deborah and I were just talking about this book and and, Deborah was kind of remarking that, it became clear to you when you finish the book a second time that you really had to have Lori come here.

Yeah, yeah.

This event, I emailed her right when I finished it the second time and said, would you consider being our speaker?

and that was, months ago, right, Lori?

Way, way before all of the political experience of the year in the fall and all that.

okay.

And what struck me was, one, you know, you spent your life helping people get resources so that they could do the things that they thought would have the most impact.

and also just the one day at a time that that's the thing that most visitors recognize.

And Susan Bianchi and so many people put Susan B Anthony into a moment and they think she was this great, successful icon.

And and they don't put her into 75 years of working for a cause.

and not seeing its fruition and not seeing, the walls and the barriers and the ups and the downs, and I just felt the second time I was, I read running with Grace.

I thought, Laurie understands this gets it.

How do you feel about that, Laurie?

I do, I, I, again, it's, you know, an honor to even think about being any kind of a comparison.

But, you know, she did pave the way.

And I do think about it that way, that it was all of these moments, all of this hard work.

You know, people think that she was this great icon, which she was, that she had a lot of struggles.

She had a lot of arguments.

And as Deborah said, you know, the one thing I totally respect about her, when you read her some of her writings and what she did is she was bipartisan and she brought people together.

And, she was a force.

But, you know, she it I think one of the things that strikes me, you know, in my career, too, I feel like I have changed some things and in finance.

But you don't do it all at once, and you don't do it by pissing everybody off.

and you kind of do it one step at a time, and you do it through education, through, I had to share a lot of my work and a lot of my intellectual property to get people to understand certain things in finance were wrong, and they were upside down.

And I thought I fought a lot of battles, but but I fought them differently.

probably because I was a woman in a very male dominated, environment.

I didn't fight them the same way.

I fought them through bringing people together, through building kind of coalitions.

I feel like she did that, you know?

And, she planted seeds, you know, that she didn't get to see all of the, you know, kind of fruits of her labor, so to speak.

But but a lot of other people did, and I think she had that kind of, it wasn't about her kind of mentality.

And, it was about the right thing to do.

It was about human rights.

It was about so many things that she was involved in that that, I relate to, like access to education, which I've spent a lot of time and Rochester on.

And, just bringing people's awareness to things.

her she was so broad and wide and people think about the women's right to vote and how she didn't even live to see that actually happen.

But that's what most people know her for.

But there was so much more to her.

And, it didn't happen overnight.

No one is an overnight success anyway.

Well, yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, Laurie's book details that.

And I also want to say, I think this is important to note here.

One of the things that I love about the way Deborah Hughes and her team does their work is they recognize that hagiography doesn't really benefit history, that if we just lionize and we don't see the real person, then they become too far removed from us.

And, Deborah, over the years, you you have so many you've had so many great stories about Susan B Anthony.

and some of them are these big soaring moments that we all know and, these pivotal historic moments and some of them are rather mundane and human.

and I think people really delight in, in remembering that this was just a person to this wasn't, you know, Susan B Anthony wasn't born into this historical figure, cast and mold.

She was a person, you know, one of our biggest drivers around our expansion of the campus is so that we can have a big exhibit area where we can share so much more of the story because, yeah, she first of all, the 19th century changed when she's born, when New York State still has slavery and she lives through the Industrial Revolution.

I mean, it's a, the world changes.

How she addresses it changes.

I think people at this point, people can get hope from that.

And a little reality and grounding, very few people know that she had at least two times in her life when she experienced what really looked like a nervous breakdown, both related to grief, from loss of a family member.

but also to what she was doing.

we.

Yeah, I've used the quote before where some reporter interviewed her later in life and said, you know, you're always, how do you deal with all these defeats?

You go back to Kansas again and again, and still women don't get the right to vote.

And her response was defeats.

There have been none.

We are always progressing.

and I think for me, Susan Anthony is she's a very real person dealing with, pragmatic response, but also really trying to challenge us to be our best.

I think, you know, we know her to, the, the endearments that people who worked with her used were Aunt Susan, which many women said you practically raised me.

and the general, which is a completely different persona.

Yeah.

And I'm sure she was both at the same time.

The event that we're talking about is the Susan B Anthony birthday celebration.

It's an annual event.

And the 2025 birthday celebration is next Wednesday.

That's February 12th, 6 p.m.. Dinner starts at the Riverside Convention Center.

Tickets still available.

What's the website?

Susan B Chaug Susan b.org if you want to attend.

Lori Van Dusen who's on the line with us, is the keynote speaker.

Laurie is the founder and CEO of Lve advisors and author of the book called running with Grace.

And boy, speaking of, you know, not being born right into this perfect cast of whatever your life became, Laurie was not necessarily always going to be a person in finance.

in fact, how good of a singer were you growing up, Laurie?

Well, I was pretty good.

I, you know, I went to the, Eastman School of Music, the property department.

After school.

My grandfather would take me.

I think they figured out I had a voice in public school and 13 or 14 years old.

So, I spent a lot of time in practice rooms and, in ensembles and musicals and all that kind of stuff.

But I was really, really lucky, kid.

I was, you know, the first person to go to college in my family, much less graduate school.

But I was raised by pretty enlightened people who embraced education and invested in their, you know, these two little kids.

And I'm a twin.

My mom was a single parent.

but I come from at least half and I, my my husband used to joke, you know, you're half Italian, but you're really 100%.

Yeah.

And because I was raised by this great Italian family, and my grandfather was my father figure, and he would bring me to the Eastman School of Music almost every day.

And so I'd have exposures.

Great.

You know, Rochester is an amazing place and have these amazing roots.

And there's just something in the water, in Rochester around innovation, the arts, everything.

And we talked about Susan B Anthony, but I was exposed to it.

He loved it.

He was first generation.

And so yeah, I was pretty good singer.

and I wanted to go to Eastman School of Music.

I had, a couple very famous professors there, teachers.

And, one of them basically told me you're not good enough.

I was crushed because I thought I was pretty good.

But, you know, when you're, when you're, small, you're a big fish in a small pond.

it seems like, you know, you're good, but when you start to get to the caliber of the people that actually, you know, I think maybe, you know, the famous opera singers that came out of the Eastman, you know, a couple of years before me, I was nowhere near, that level.

So I went I ended up at Ithaca College, and I started out thinking, okay, I can still explore music and realized that it was mostly education oriented, and I didn't want that.

And so I did whatever immature 18 or 19 year old does.

I just changed my majors and stayed there.

And I had a really fun experience there.

really fun college experience, which I think, you know, we I would just hope for every kid to have the ability to learn and also learn stuff outside of the classroom.

And, finally made my way.

it's all in the book, but made my way to Wall Street.

but it was a circuitous path.

But I do think that music and pattern recognition and the things that I learned at the Eastman were amazing for a young girl like, you know, they have these, these, re-admission process called juries where you would have to just go in and sing a bunch of pieces in front of passers, and no one would say anything.

You just start singing, they'd start writing, you'd leave, and then you'd find out if you got accepted back into the program.

At least that's what I recall from, that period of time.

So it taught you a lot about discipline and hard work, but music itself and the arts are amazing for other things.

So I really credit a lot of that early training to being able to kind of navigate the stuff I have in finance on Wall Street, in my, in my walk.

So, but before you really dig in to finance, I do want to ask you if you think if your understanding of of one really hard event in your life, if some of the dynamics have changed now for people go through it.

And I mentioned earlier that when you were at Harvard, you were raped by a PhD, a man who had propositioned you.

I think you mentioned he was already married and he wanted to date you anyway.

And you said no very firmly.

He, what was able to get past security, get in your room.

He raped you.

And and I want to.

I just want to read from your book about the decision you had to make, about what you did next.

Here's what you write.

You write.

Quote.

I don't remember much afterward, except that the next day I told a close friend who encouraged me to go to the campus security.

I said I couldn't.

I was frantic, no one would believe me.

It would be my word against his.

It would be humiliating.

I didn't want to relive it.

I wasn't strong enough.

I would never finish my degree if I went after him.

Harvard was hard enough.

He would win.

I would lose everything I'd worked so hard to achieve.

I was not going to give him that satisfaction.

End quote.

do you think things are I mean, this is I think that's the better part of 40 years ago.

Do you think things are different now?

Yes.

I think things are different now, but I think, the decision to go forward is still, in today's world, very, very difficult because if you, you know, look, there's I am also I, I am not a political person one way or the other.

And, I have two sons and I think, I would hate the thought of anyone accusing them of something they didn't do.

But in this case, this person should have been held accountable.

And I believe, I if this were today, I would have had a much better shot at holding this person accountable and finishing my degree.

I still think it's a very hard thing to do.

And I do believe what I wrote.

have to think about my book.

You know, everything in it is true.

And it's how I was feeling and thinking at the time that it would be distracting.

I would I would be, derailed.

I frankly did not think my masters, my Master of Education program, was that easy.

I, I wanted to focus on it.

And I had this kind of, equivalent, this pursuit.

I wanted to continue to pursue my degree.

So I made this choice.

I'm not, you know, and I'm very careful in the book to say, I think I say something like, you know, I know I'll be criticized for this, or I could be criticized for making that decision.

I don't think anybody should be the judge and jury on these things.

what what he did was absolutely horrific and wrong.

But for me, it was my choice at the time.

And I think it is easier to, be heard now.

I think, it's a different world in a lot of ways.

but but I also, as I was writing the book, had an epiphany that I'd never had.

And this just tells you something about these kinds of traumatic events in your life.

I never connected the fact that I almost failed out of Harvard, with that rape incident because I got to a class, was taking a final blue book exam, and I just blanked.

I just could not retrieve anything.

And I never, ever related the two things until I was writing a book.

So it's, I would I would say to people is it's a very personal decision.

I would think that, people would use the resources that they have.

It is it is, people should be held accountable.

And, also, though the one thing that I learned from writing the book is that, you need to go get help, too.

You need to talk it through because it's, it's a tough thing to, to navigate.

so I don't know if that answers your question.

No, it's certainly I don't really sidestep it.

I just really I don't think it's an easy thing.

And any, any age or anytime, I don't think you sidestep it at all.

I thought that I think that is a remarkably reflective, answer to a really, really obviously traumatic moment.

just one of the stories and running with Grace Laurie's book.

And so we're going to fast forward ahead a little bit here because it's 1247 and I've got to, you know, you're going to have to pick up the book if you want to.

All the stories.

We can't do all of them here.

but or you can go to the event next week and hear more from Laurie at the Susan B Anthony birthday celebration that's happening on February 12th, where Laurie will be the keynote speaker.

Laurie, you know, you get to Wall Street, and this rather unlikely path, you go to Lehman Brothers of all places, and you say in the book, you know, considering the values that you held and certainly your grandfather and the people who helped instill values in you, there's an irony that it was Lehman Brothers, but certainly it was a challenge for any woman on Wall Street, in the 80s.

That's been well documented.

What what do you want listeners to understand about the way that you were able to build this career, despite the fact that it was really lined up against women, especially in the 80s into the 90s?

I think I'd want anybody to understand, especially young women and young men.

because I'm a mom and a mentor.

is life is not fair.

We can try to make it more fair.

We can try to bring more access to things, to people.

But it isn't fair.

Things will happen.

And, what you choose to do with them.

Those things, good and bad, are really the determining factor.

And I think what people would see if if they knew me, if they read the book, is that I didn't give up.

you take things one at a time.

I worked, I outworked people, I didn't expect, anything when I showed up.

It ended up being, the Shearson side of Lehman Brothers, that Hyatt was hired by Lehman Brothers and went through, share some Lehman and all the iterations of that.

I didn't really expect anything.

I didn't in the most amazing thing about it.

And I think the blessing that I had, was besides the great upbringing I had and the perspective was, I didn't know I was different.

I was taught not to think in gender, not to think in color, not to think in, socioeconomic anything.

I'm a girl from Rochester, New York, who grew up on Farragut Street and then in gates, New York.

And as I said before, first person to go to college, was some Trump from, some really he not what you would expect right to to have this this kind of career.

And so if I can do it, anybody can do it.

It's just a lot of hard work.

which leads to purpose and resiliency.

And, you know, I hope that the book we talked about some really heavy things, but I hope that the book is actually I think if people read it, I hope they they get inspiration from it.

They can relate to it because it's not about, it's, it's it's that anybody can do what they set out to do within reason.

And you are going to have setbacks.

Right?

I want I want to read another section here because the book absolutely does do that.

And I want to talk a little bit about how you view money.

and I want to read from a passage here because I think it turns a little bit about the idea of money on its head.

Sometimes.

Sometimes, sometimes we are thinking or perhaps taught that, you know, if you can only make X amount, your life will be better.

or or, you know, everything will change for you.

And you write the following quote in a sermon I heard many years ago, the pastor said, money only makes you more of what you already are.

And it's true.

This is Laurie now writing.

It's true.

Money is simply money.

It's spiritually neutral.

It's not the ticket to happiness or the root of all evil.

This popular expression is a common misquote of the Bible verse from one Timothy.

First Timothy Timothy reads, for the love of money is the root of all evil, which, while some coveted after they have aired from the faith and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Having money and coveting money are two very different things.

Right now.

I have enough money, but I don't covet it.

End quote I think that's really important because there's a lot of really interesting happiness research.

I mean, literally research on human happiness and, the line is moved, but, you know, there's always an interesting number that, you know, what do you need to make where if you make more, you're really kind of in diminishing returns territory.

And it's not as much as people think.

What that research tends to find reflects what Laurie writes in her book, which is basically, you certainly need money to live in our society, and money will make things easier to live, but it is not going to change your values or make you a better person.

your values have to come from, you know, yourself or or how perhaps how you were raised or those around you.

And I just love the idea of money only makes you more of what you already are.

So, Lori, can you expound on that a little bit and talk to me about how you work with clients to understand what their goals should be, and then maybe how to route what they're doing toward those goals and not just obsessed about, a bank account or a bottom line.

Yeah.

I mean, I do love that quote, too, about money because we personify it and I don't know why.

And you're right, it's a it's a bottomless pit or a bucket that you can never fill if you approach life with.

If only I have more, I'll be happy when I get to this, this place or this destination, or if I have this job or if I have this car, or if I have this partner, or if I have, then I'll be happy.

and it doesn't work that way.

Or I'm, you know, kind of here to say, we we do help people, in a very customized way, understand what it is that they're trying to do, you know, kind of how they're trying to use whatever resources they have.

And I think, you know, really understanding, understanding the dynamics, understanding what their purpose is or helping them find their purpose, is really part of what we do as good financial advisors.

So really understanding the complete picture and moving people towards goals and helping them sleep at night, you know, I think there is a lot of study, research around this.

there's, you know, some of the most unhappy people that I've met, my wife have a lot of money.

So, yeah, it is so, you know.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

But I think happiness and peacefulness are very different things.

And I think our job as good financial advisors is to, help people utilize money to get that kind of peace of mind.

They need to live their life and do the things that are purposeful.

And I think there is a reason we're on this planet and it's not to accumulate a bunch of money.

but money is a powerful tool.

And, you know, I've found, like in my life that, and quite by accident, we could go on for hours.

And I know we don't have that, but I would say quite by accident.

And part of this is in the book that, by using money in kind of these purposeful ways and giving back, it's created more friendships, more joy, than I could ever have, you know, imagined.

So I think that's part of our job is to understand, you know, how clients, how people view their money, what's giving them, you know, kind of uncertainty or chaos and trying to quell that and get them to a place where they can be more purposeful in what they're doing in life and live life, you know?

Yeah.

For sure.

Yeah, I would I would tell listeners, Laurie's a big deal.

When Laurie, decided to kind of go out on her own in 2012, 2013, I mean, literally made headlines in the financial world.

So there's plenty of great and really powerful and important Wall Street material in the book here.

But I wanted to pull that passage because I think obviously the reason Laurie's done so well is because she's a good financial advisor, but she's also just sort of a good person advisor.

I mean, like, that's that's a big part of life right there.

And, I thought that was great.

And as we get ready to close here, Deborah, I mean, I think that brings us back to this idea that, we've come a long way from 172 years ago when a 33 year old Susan B Anthony was writing in her diary, musing about how a wife wasn't even allowed to own her own money and make her own income, and it was assumed to belong to her husband.

you know, we have come a long way.

I don't know that everybody says we're exactly where we need to be.

I wonder what Susan B Anthony would think of this moment.

Yeah, I, you know, I think of the perseverance as a metaphor.

around freedom, you know, people choosing what?

You're just like.

Lori got to choose what she wanted to follow for her career.

freedom, education.

I mean, there's so much in our purse and our resources, and I think the ultimate question is, what do you want to do with those?

and one of the things that I hope for next week when we get together is that people will leave, having had some good things to think about, but also leaving hopeful and pragmatic.

Lori, we got less than a minute.

Oh, well, you're the keynote speaker at the Susan B Anthony birthday celebration next Wednesday, February 12th.

It's a big event.

you want to just let people know about 30s, the kind of themes you're going to bring?

Yeah, I am going to tell you about a purse of your own and why it's so important to have financial independence and that people define that differently because you get to pursue your dreams with no conflicts of interest.

And, it's a very powerful thing.

So I'll talk a little bit about that.

I'll talk a little bit about Rochester and, the history of some of the most amazing history around Susan B Anthony and the people that she knew and how if I were born five years earlier, even I might not have been able to do what I did.

the book is called running with Grace A Wall Street Insider's Path to True Leadership, a purposeful life and joy in the Face of adversity.

After convincing herself and talking to her kids and figuring out that she had a book here, this thing is now a Wall Street Journal bestseller.

Congratulations, Lori Van Dusen, thanks for sharing the story with us.

And we'll see you in Rochester next week.

Thank you.

Hi, Evan and I have a great having you and Deborah, executive director of the National Susan B Anthony Museum and House.

Happy birthday to Susan B.

Have a great event.

Susan b.org is the website.

If you want tickets that are still available.

Thank you for being here.

Thanks, Evan.

Always great having you.

We've got more connections coming up in just a moment.

And.

I.

Hope.

That.

You.

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